An in depth study of Pam and Barbara (Secret 7)

[Debbie]

Do we need so much information about the two non entities of the Secret Seven?

Au contraire. I think it is great to focus on characters that aren't in the forefront of every story. Let's face it, in a group of seven children (or adults, for that matter) there are bound to be a couple or so that stray in the background, somewhat. I look forward to more topics of this type - it makes a change from all the hero-worshipping of the lead characters. This has been an interesting topic, Pete, thanks for promoting/discussing the more minor regulars. I have always loved the Secret Seven, and as a 7-year-old, never considered that characters such as Pam, Barbara, Colin and George were 'characterless'. It certainly entertains me more than games such as 'change a letter'!

I agree with this. Likewise I don't see Larry, Pip and Daisy as characterless or irrelevant to the story.

It's more that we notice the big parts of personalities more. As said, Jack's biggest bit is being Suzie's brother, and in a lot of ways the reason Janet stands out from the other girls is because she's Peter's sister, so we see the "at home" parts. So actually really they're a nice bunch of quiet children with the leader, Peter, and obviously Scamper, which in some ways is nice for children to be able to identify with them.

Thinking about it, does anyone ever criticise Jill and Mary in the Adventurous Four for not having a personality? I don't think so. But in some ways they're quite similar to Barbara and Pam: They do things together, and I think at one point it's said that one is more adventurous, but I don't think it's particularly obvious from the story. You wouldn't look at a speech or action and know which one did it. You accept it because they're twins, but in a lot of ways the adventures could take place without them, and they take the roles of "girls to protect" without adding a huge amount to it. But because there's only four of them, they naturally take on more importance.

It's only natural that with a group of children, some will take more importance than others. But the secondary characters would be missed if they weren't there. Would The Famous Five work without Dick, for example? What about the Secret Series without Nora? The stories would work, but they would be less rich as a story because of that. We need the background people so the leaders and the trailblazers can stand out and show that they are the leaders.

[pete9012S]

A most balanced post Debbie, thank you.

I started this topic purely just for my own amusement, as like Bertie I haven't really taken the Secret Seven very seriously over the years.
If I'm honest, back in the day, I saw the Secret Seven as books my younger brother Mike read, whilst I was on the Famous Five's etc...

What drew me in was book's covers. I had to read them privately in case my younger brother caught me reading his books.

These were the covers that appealed to me when I was young:

[GloomyGraham]

I had to read them privately in case my younger brother caught me reading his books.

When I think about boys reading things privately (probably under their bed-clothes with the aid of a torch), Secret Seven books are not the first thing that springs to mind. lol

[pete9012S]

Ha Ha!
Good one GG.

[Bertie]

These were the covers that appealed to me when I was young:

I've got most of the series with those same Knights paperback covers. However, my Go Ahead Secret Seven is the rubbishy 1976 version. I much prefer the one above although, even though I know he's looking down a hole, I keep seeing the character as being on a spaceship or frisbee in the sky!

[Moonraker]

A most balanced post Debbie, thank you.

Yes, you probably put it more succinctly than I did, Debbie!

Incidentally, my comment re games threads was just a personal opinion. It wasn't my intention to rubbish them. As John said, if you don't like a topic then stay away from it. When I first joined the Society and registered for the forums, almost twenty years ago, I read every post. Now, I just select the topics that might be of interest to me.

[Barnard]

What I posted about this Pam and Barbara thread was also just a ‘personal opinion’ without ‘rubbishing’it.
Likewise, if people don’t like my cryptic clues or my ‘pomes’, they don’t have to.
As long as a few people are all right with them I’ll continue to post them.

[pete9012S]

Next:

Let's see how Pam & Barbara fare in Good Work Secret Seven:


Spine and front cover from the 1st edition, illustrated by Bruno Kay 1954.


1969 Knight, illustrations and cover by Derek Lucas

Some of the paperbacks:
https://www.enidblytonsociety.co.uk/boo ... cret+Seven



Pam gets 31 mentions in this book and Barbara gets 19 which is nice.

What about the other characters? How many mentions do they get?

Peter 240
Colin 90
Jack 77
Susie 73
Janet 63
Scamper 50
George 29

Plot:

Peter and Janet's father's car is stolen—with them inside! But rather than feel sorry for themselves, the Seven investigate—and keep watch on the mysterious Sid's Place. And what on earth is Q8061?

https://www.enidblyton.net/secret-seven/

Pam gets cold feet, then quickly changes her mind after Peter gives her an ultimatum:

" But how can we ? " asked Pam. " I don't like the sound of them, anyway."
"Well, if you don't want to be in on this, there's nothing to stop you from walking out," said
Peter, getting cross with Pam. "The door's over there."
Pam changed her mind in a hurry. " Oh no—I want to be in on this; of course I do. You tell us
what to do, Peter."

Peter rules this club run from a shed that sometimes doubles as an onion storage unit with a rod of iron..

Soon Pam's confidence returns - how does Peter respond?

" That's silly! " said Pam. " We'd have to look all through every number in the telephone book
— we don't even know the name of the exchange! "
Peter took no notice of Pam. "

Third time lucky for Pam, and once more she is back in Commandant Peter's good books:

"Q8061," said Pam, promptly. "I think of it as the letter Q—but it might be spelt K-E-W, you
know."
"Yes, you're right. It might," said Peter. " That's really quite an idea, Pam.

What about our Barb with her humble 18 mentions? How does she fare in this story?

At the outset, Barbara seems to be lacking a little confidence:

" How do we set about it ? " said Barbara.
" I really can't explain such easy things to you," said Peter, impatiently. " You and Pam can
quite well work out what to do yourselves.

So Peter gives Barbara short thrift, and also links Pam & Barbara together. They do seem to be the Secret Seven's permanent double act..

No health and safety for The Secret Seven;

It was a very, very sad ending to the tea and meeting at Colin's. Barbara was in tears. She had saved
up for weeks to buy fireworks—and now there was nothing left of them but smoke and smell and a
nasty-looking black mess.

It's quite put our adventure out of my mind," said Pam. "But I suppose we'd better think about
it again to-morrow, Barbara. We've got to find out about that telephone number—Kew 8061. Though
how we shall do it, I don't know."
" Leave it till to-morrow," said Barbara. " I can't think of anything but our poor fireworks today."

Poor Barbara.

Pamela was first. Then came Jack, hurrying in case he was late. Then George, carrying a bag of
rosy apples as his share of the food. Then Barbara, wondering if the password was Guy Fawkes or
Bonfire Night. Oh dear!

Peter directs the adventure from the barrow..




Pam working hard on the case..


Another bloke in authority pays them a visit..


And gives them a reward..

The rear blurb:



The further reading recommendation:



I've never heard of The Moffats, have you?






STILL HERE??
SPECIAL EXTRA TREAT:

Please check out the superb original illustrations to this book in the cave.

Also:


This book was originally serialised in Enid Blyton's Magazine from No. 22 Vol. 1, December 23rd 1953 to No. 17 Vol. 2, August 18th 1954. As well as the title picture each chapter had one illustration by Bruno Kay


A superb original illustration from the Cave.

See all the illustrations Tony has included in the cave for us here:
https://www.enidblytonsociety.co.uk/boo ... cret+Seven

[Moonraker]

What on earth is the man doing in the garden? It looks like he's fishing...

[pete9012S]

Good spot Nigel!

The pic in green:



Enlarging the pic doesn't seem to help.

I turned to one of the 'new' (1969) illustrations:



So Derek Lucas seems to make it look like the man is holding a rake, hoe or brush??

Here's the same man from the book and then the magazine:




Interestingly, this man is NOT the man in the pic with the stick, as he calls the second man with the pipe out of the house!
So Although showing a legible stick, Derek Lucas has got this element wrong!

They cycled on to Raynes Road.
It was only a little lane, set with pretty little cottages. Little-Hill was at one end, a nice little
place with a gay garden.

" Well—it doesn't look like the home of a rogue," said Jack. "But you never know. See—there's
someone in the garden, Peter. Come on, do your job—let's see how you handle things of this sort.
Make him admit he dropped that spectacle case in your father's car! "
" Right!" said Peter, and went in boldly at the garden gate. "Er—good afternoon, sir—are you
Mr. Briggs?"

CHAPTER TEN
Peter Feels Hot All Over
As soon as Peter saw the man closely, he knew at once that he wasn't either of the men in the
car. For one thing, this man had a big round head, and a face to match—and both the other men had
had rather narrow heads, as far as he had been able to see.

The man looked a little surprised. "No," he said. "I'm not Mr. Briggs. I'm just a friend staying
with him. Do you want him? I'll call him?"
Peter began to feel a little uncomfortable. Somehow this pretty garden and trim little cottage
didn't seem the kind of place those men would live in!

"Henry! Henry, there's someone asking for you! " called the man.
Peter saw that the other Secret Seven members were watching eagerly—would " Henry " prove
to be one of the men they were hunting for ?
A man came strolling out—someone with trim, short hair and a narrow head. Yes—he might be
the man who had sat in the left-hand seat of the
car—except that he didn't in the least look as if he could possibly take someone else's car!

[TheAngryPixie]

When I read the Secret Seven books, I never pictured them all wearing private eye trenchcoats. Yet they make quite a few appearances in illustrations.

I always imagined various school uniforms, or casual shorts and a jersey.

[pete9012S]

Ah yes, A.P. The ubiquitous gaberdine mac.
I had to wear one when I started my Ursuline Convent in the early 1970's!

[Anita Bensoussane]

Interesting observations about the two men.

My favourite Knight paperback covers are as follows (I seem to favour tense/creepy nighttime scenes and autumnal colours):

[pete9012S]

Yes, lovely covers Anita.

I know Nigel likes the originals, but because I was born a little later in time than him, I like the 1960's artwork too!

[John Pickup]

I prefer the original covers too. George Brook and Bruno Kay and, to a lesser extent, Burgess Sharrocks, captured the period they were written in very well. The boys all wore caps like I had to at school.