"Don't mention the war."

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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Courtenay »

Anita Bensoussane wrote: 19 Nov 2023, 11:42 The Island of Adventure was almost a war novel. In Enid Blyton - A Literary Life, Andrew Maunder says that Macmillan initially wanted Enid to write them an adventure novel "based on a plot of their own design. This featured two teenagers, an older girl and a younger boy, returning from the United States to do war work in Britain via the Atlantic (a perilous crossing, given the threat of being torpedoed by German submarines). Once in London, the girl would get a job at the Admiralty, during which time she would meet an American pilot (on leave after being wounded on a bombing raid over Germany). He would take the girl and her brother under his wing." [These details were outlined in a memorandum dated 16th July 1943]. Macmillan felt that such a story would cement the bond between the USA and Britain, and establish Enid Blyton in America.

However, Enid wasn't keen on writing war-based fiction by that stage. On 19th July 1943 she wrote in a letter to Macmillan: "...do you mind if I don't write a book bringing in the war? I say this for two reasons - one is that the war inevitably dates a book, and after the war is over few people will want to read about it - certainly we shall want our children to forget it! Another reason is that there are still a great many people who definitely will not buy a book about the war for their children - they prefer stories that take the children's minds away from it, and this is quite right."

As Db105 and Courtenay have said, Enid Blyton hoped to avoid her stories being seen as period pieces, and wanted them to provide an escape for children.
Ah, now that's quite fascinating, to have a direct statement from Enid confirming why she preferred not to write books "bringing in the war"! And yes, that is interesting that she was thinking of future sales and wanting to avoid her books feeling dated, as well as wanting to take children's minds off the war during and after it. I'd guessed the latter reason was in her mind, but I wasn't sure if she was thinking of the former ("the war inevitably dates a book"), and now we know she was.

Of course for many of today's young and not-so-young readers, WW2 and other now-historical periods are very interesting to read about. But if I'd lived through that war as a child, I can imagine I wouldn't much like to be reminded of it in fictional works, since the reality would have been hard enough to live through as it was — not only all the rationing and restrictions and general sense of fear, but especially for those who'd lost family and friends in the fighting or in the bombings. I'm thinking if I were in that position, I probably wouldn't enjoy reading fictional stories about that time.

I don't think the Covid pandemic of 2020-21 seriously compares to WW2 in scope, but it was certainly the longest and most widespread public crisis since the war, and I'm aware it already features in books written during and after it. I don't want to read any of them. Even though I personally wasn't too badly affected — no-one close to me died or became seriously ill, and because I work in the care sector, I didn't lose my job and my work routines didn't change very much — it was still a very difficult time and I would rather not keep on being reminded of it any more than necessary. There are plenty of other people who suffered much worse than I and my family did, and I wouldn't be surprised if they don't want to be reminded of it constantly either. But then, in decades to come, young readers who weren't around then will quite possibly find it an interesting historical topic, just as we in the post-war generations do with WW2!

Shifting the topic a bit to another writer of the same period as Enid Blyton — this is reminding me of another of my favourite classic series for children, the Chronicles of Narnia by C.S. Lewis. As some here will remember, the first book he wrote in the series, The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe,* opens with the four children being "sent away from London during the war because of the air-raids", to stay with the old Professor in his big old house in the country. But that one sentence in the opening paragraph is the only reference to "the war" in the entire book. I'm also a member of an online Narnia forum and we've had several discussions about this topic there too! :wink:

Some modern adaptations of the story have made a big feature of the wartime setting — the 2005 film shows the children experiencing a bombing raid shortly before they leave their home, and a stage version of it that I saw some years ago played up the WW2 references even more, including while the children are in Narnia. But Lewis, who started writing this story in the late 1940s (it was first published in 1950), doesn't do that at all. There are no points where his child characters are shown to be thinking or talking about the war and worrying about their parents or other relatives, and there are no comparisons — even implied ones — between the war in our own world and the White Witch's tyrannical rule over Narnia. Lewis just uses "the war" as a plot device to get his child characters away from their parents — always a handy thing when you're writing a fantasy adventure for young readers — and then never brings it up again. I'm guessing that, especially as he too was writing soon after the real-life war for an audience who would remember it, he felt his young readers wouldn't want or need to be reminded of it.

* Which, to tie in with the discussion in the English spelling and grammar thread, has never had an Oxford comma in the title. :wink:
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Anita Bensoussane »

Good points, Courtenay. When I read The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe as a child, I barely noticed the reference to the Second World War. As an adult, I can't help feeling that it's ironic for the children to be evacuated during wartime, only to end up fighting a battle! Of course, we're led to believe that they're fulfilling a prophecy, so perhaps there's no real danger even though their lives appear to be at risk (because things will inevitably turn out as foretold).

Mr. Beaver says, "...down at Cair Paravel there are four thrones and it's a saying in Narnia time out of mind that when two Sons of Adam and two Daughters of Eve sit in those four thrones, then it will be the end not only of the White Witch's reign but of her life, and that is why we had to be so cautious as we came along, for if she knew about you four, your lives wouldn't be worth a shake of my whiskers!"

The prophecy is also recited as a rhyme:

When Adam's flesh and Adam's bone
Sits at Cair Paravel in throne,
The evil time will be over and done.


Although it's possible that Peter, Susan, Edmund and Lucy aren't the four human beings spoken of in the prophecy, most Narnians seem to think it highly likely that they are (as does the reader, naturally!)
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Fiona1986 »

I noticed this week that rations are mentioned in Five Go Off to Camp. George mentions that Mrs Andrews has given them lots of food and "she doesn't seem to be concerned about rations" or words to that effect.
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Courtenay »

Anita Bensoussane wrote: 21 Nov 2023, 14:30 Good points, Courtenay. When I read The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe as a child, I barely noticed the reference to the Second World War. As an adult, I can't help feeling that it's ironic for the children to be evacuated during wartime, only to end up fighting a battle! Of course, we're led to believe that they're fulfilling a prophecy, so perhaps there's no real danger even though though their lives appear to be at risk (because things will inevitably turn out as foretold).
Perhaps, yes. I was just making the point, though, that Lewis as the author never draws any kind of parallel between the war in this world and the battle (or the overall struggle against the Witch) in Narnia. We don't see the two boys, as they prepare for the battle, thinking of their father or any other male relatives who may be fighting in the war at home (we're not told at all whether they are). We're not told that Edmund's cravings for the Witch's enchanted Turkish Delight are made worse by the fact that he hardly ever gets sweet treats these days because of the rationing. And no comparisons are ever drawn, even implicitly, between the Witch's reign over Narnia and Hitler's conquest of most of Western Europe.

Another reason for that, in this case, could be that in this particular book / series, readers are to understand that Narnia, while it's a magical land, is a real world in its own right with no connection to our own world. We're not meant to get any impression that events in Narnia run parallel to events on Earth, let alone that Narnia is somehow a product of the children's own imagination, that it's a projection of their own thoughts and fears about the war they're experiencing in their own world. (Like how the 1939 film of The Wizard of Oz made out that Dorothy's trip to Oz was a dream she had when she was knocked unconscious during the cyclone, and the various characters she meets there are alter egos of people she knows in real life — whereas in the original books by L. Frank Baum, Oz is definitely real.)

This is all getting off the topic of Enid Blyton not including the war in most of her books, mind you! Even in her fantasy stories where "ordinary" children journey into magical lands — the Faraway Tree and Wishing-Chair books — we don't have any war references that might suggest that either her characters are escaping from the war in this world, or finding that there is a similar war going on in any of the fantasy lands they visit. It obviously just wasn't the way she wrote most of the time, or what she wanted to write.

In the few stories where she does bring WW2 into it, she sometimes has her child characters do something to help the war effort, like uncovering plots by enemy spies (as in Smuggler Ben and The Children of Kidillin) — a bit of wish fulfillment for her readers, perhaps! But, especially going by what we've seen from that letter to Macmillan, it looks like she quickly realised stories of that sort would soon become dated and she seems to have stopped writing them well before the war was over.
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Courtenay »

Fiona1986 wrote: 21 Nov 2023, 15:07 I noticed this week that rations are mentioned in Five Go Off to Camp. George mentions that Mrs Andrews has given them lots of food and "she doesn't seem to be concerned about rations" or words to that effect.
There's a rarity... I wonder why Enid slipped in that case when she normally has farmers' wives and other kindly local women loading the Five with more food than most normal human beings could possibly eat! :wink: Five Go Off to Camp was first published in 1948, three years after the war ended, but of course rationing remained in place for some years even after that — I think it wasn't completely lifted until 1953 — so realistically, it's unlikely that even the most generous-hearted ladies could have been so unstinting. Maybe Enid had some young readers writing to her complaining that they never got such huge helpings of all kinds of foods because of the rationing, so they thought it was a bit unfair that the Five seem to get whatever food they want??
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Hannah »

You're probably right. That's in Spiteful Letters, published in 1946.
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Anita Bensoussane »

Courtenay wrote: 21 Nov 2023, 15:24
Anita Bensoussane wrote: 21 Nov 2023, 14:30Good points, Courtenay. When I read The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe as a child, I barely noticed the reference to the Second World War. As an adult, I can't help feeling that it's ironic for the children to be evacuated during wartime, only to end up fighting a battle! Of course, we're led to believe that they're fulfilling a prophecy, so perhaps there's no real danger even though though their lives appear to be at risk (because things will inevitably turn out as foretold).
Perhaps, yes. I was just making the point, though, that Lewis as the author never draws any kind of parallel between the war in this world and the battle (or the overall struggle against the Witch) in Narnia. We don't see the two boys, as they prepare for the battle, thinking of their father or any other male relatives who may be fighting in the war at home (we're not told at all whether they are). We're not told that Edmund's cravings for the Witch's enchanted Turkish Delight are made worse by the fact that he hardly ever gets sweet treats these days because of the rationing. And no comparisons are ever drawn, even implicitly, between the Witch's reign over Narnia and Hitler's conquest of most of Western Europe.
True! Reading your post just set me off on a bit of a digression!

Fiona1986 wrote: 21 Nov 2023, 15:07I noticed this week that rations are mentioned in Five Go Off to Camp. George mentions that Mrs Andrews has given them lots of food and "she doesn't seem to be concerned about rations" or words to that effect.
That's interesting, Fiona. As Courtenay says, it's rather surprising given that Julian, Dick, George and Anne haven't had any trouble getting food in earlier books (even during the reign of the Sticks they helped themselves to chicken and jam tarts from the pantry, and were able to buy sausage rolls from a shop in the village).
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Debbie »

I'm trying to think when I first read that book because I wouldn't have been aware of rationing, so I think I'd have taken it to mean that Mrs Andrews had been generous on the portion side.

Maybe Kirrin Village was just one big blackmarket. :lol:
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Courtenay »

Debbie wrote: 21 Nov 2023, 20:28 Maybe Kirrin Village was just one big blackmarket. :lol:
Reckon Debbie's hit on the truth here. No wonder Enid was vague about Kirrin's actual location... :wink:
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Barnard »

Perhaps gluttonous children were allowed as much food as they wanted.
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Hannah »

It seems that the mentioning of rations became the victim of an editor.

In the older edition it reads:
“We got eggs and butter and fruit, and even some bacon,” said George. “The boy’s mother didn’t seem worried about rations, and she hardly charged us anything. We didn’t see the farmer.”
In the Kindle edition it says:
‘We got eggs and butter and fruit, and even some bacon,’ said George. ‘The boy’s mother didn’t seem worried about how much we had, and she hardly charged us anything. We didn’t see the farmer.’
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Anita Bensoussane »

Thanks for quoting from the text, Hannah. I've never seen the mention of "rations" because my copy of Five Go Off to Camp is a 1970 Knight paperback, in which "rations" has already been altered to "how much we had".

At the front of my book it says:
This edition published 1967 by Knight Books,
the paperback division of Brockhampton Press Ltd, Leicester
Fourth impression 1970

Printed and bound in Great Britain by
Cox & Wyman Ltd, London, Reading and Fakenham

First published by Hodder & Stoughton Ltd 1948
Eleventh impression 1964
Reissued by Brockhampton Press Ltd 1967
Second impression 1970
That makes me think that the change might have been made for the 1967 edition, which is when Five Go Off to Camp was brought out as a paperback.

Someone must have gone through the books with a fine-tooth comb in an attempt to remove what they judged to be dated references. It's strange that they didn't also take the opportunity of dealing with discrepancies in characters' names (Alf/James; Joanna/Joan) and other glaring anomalies.
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Wolfgang »

In the German edition the part "‘The boy’s mother didn’t seem worried about how much we had/rations" is completely missing.
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by Yak »

Ah that's interesting - I had no idea that there had been a mention of rations there. Some of the books I have the original edition of as I inherited them from my mum but some I have much more modern editions.
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Re: "Don't mention the war."

Post by GloomyGraham »

Interesting discussions - especially Anita's story of the publisher's 'ingredients list' of a story they wanted her to write.

For a long-running series like the FF it probably did make sense to not date it.

As a child I found it a bit strange in Malcolm Saville's 'Lone Pine' series that the first two stories took place during the war but later - with the children having hardly aged - another book ('Not Scarlet But Gold' I think it was) where the major plot was about the war happening twenty years or so before.
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