TV locations for the Famous Five series

[FiveFanDownunder]

Dutch Barn update:

Still a few problems with the barn at Lepe Farm. I have found the plans for its construction, in 1949(!); a 30' arch and five bays for 75' length. It's a Boulton and Paul manufactured barn and it appears that many examples may be around. The barn at Lower Exbury is almost certainly from the same company, but features an asbestos roof.

It appears that the barn in BH has at least six bays, and also an asbestos roof, as opposed to the galvanised roof mentioned on the plans and confirmed in the images above from Adrian and in Google historic street view in 2012.

Neither can I match the views of the red brick farm house with the plans of Lepe Farm I can find, though it is a very good 'match' for starters. Just can't be pinned down or ruled out either way.

Still looking, and more than happy if others are 100% set on Lepe Farm. That's locations ... and I thought all the mysteries were solved!!

The plan is the best I can do, the original on line is a very small image. It is interesting to note that the options not relevant to this particular barn have been struck out, suggesting that the kits were varied according to preference and the plans generated from a template of sorts.

[FiveFanDownunder]

Billycock Barn fossicking continues.

I am still not able to either prove or rule out Lepe Farm for myself as the location of either the barn shot at the end of BH, and the shots of UQ in front of a red brick farm house around about the same time in the episode, though I know others are happy to say it's the right spot.

Just un update on my digging around:

The below plans are dated 1992, and show a *proposed* site plan for the change of building use from agricultural to commercial and the building of a sewerage plant?? The dutch barns are shown as the dotted rectangle toward the top, abutting a larger structure which appears to be the longer shed seen in Camp, the backdrop when the boys examine the tractor in the yard and the kids first meet Jock. The small shed seen beyond the farm workers, when Julian stops for a moment to watch them playing cards, is still in place.

Both evidence in the Camp episode and the proportions on the plan match the side-by-side arrangement, with the double gables seen in Camp from the SE side.

The long rectangular shaded structure closest to the house is noted as the milking parlour, with the barn between that and the dutch barns designated calf shed.



The below image is the oldest useful aerial shot I can find, with the dutch barns in place, but new structures added to the north boundary and the smaller shed to the south side removed. Another new shed near the dutch barns is also evident.



This is the current Google maps image showing us that the milking parlour has lost its roof; the dutch barn and grain drying shed completely gone and a newer boxy structure further in to the east side.



The questions I am still looking to answer is whether I can find evidence of the building seen in BH in the extreme left of shot, the mature tree behind the kids, and the much narrower gated track with trees close behind. All imagery and plans I can find show this area as much more open. It seems that there may be plans and alterations for Lepe Farm House that are not locatable via the website we have been using these last few years. The porches and windows currently featured on the farm house are not a match for 1977 and there are no plans I can find for any alterations. Still looking.

I have an enquiry in with another gov site and am hoping to land an aerial shot of the farm in the 70s. There should be what I think is a narrower building on the site, probably running parallel to the milking parlour, with an eastern end closer to the dutch barns, and evidence of a much narrower gated drive/path beyond to take the track east behind the barns.

The below shot shows the mystery building, tree and gate, and a much narrower space behind. It is logical that this are would have been altered for the newer shed/sewerage plant to go up, so hopeful that this can be proven!



I'll let you know if I strike it lucky.

[timv]

Looking West at the site of the demolished double barns at the NW end of the Lepe Farm farmyard - a photo which Adrian took a few years ago, I think in 2021. This was taken from a spot in what would be 'inside the barn, in the middle of the piles of corn bales' in the FF 1978 Billycock Hill episode shot of the children arriving at the yard with Toby, if the latter scene was shot here (which seems likeliest given the context). In this case, the 'entrance to the yard with a wide gateway and a fence' and with a tree to the left would be at the extreme left of this pic - so is the line of foliage on the far left the tree and the low bit of hedge to its right the gateway site??

The line of trees in the distance in this shot, ie to the West/ North-West of Lepe Farm, might fit the line of trees in the rear of the 1978 shot of the children entering the yard. They seem to be about 50-100 yards away from the farm, or possibly a bit further. From what I remember of our trips by car and my own walks from Exbury to Gatewood there are quite a lot of highish oaks and chestnuts along and in the fields near that road, which is some way to the NW of Lepe Farm, and there is also the wooded valley of the Dark Water (ie the stream that flows under Gatewood bridge) and its adjoining woods off to the North. Fields here are usually divided by trees along hedges, and still are now: so there are plenty of trees around here. Possibly the shot of the children entering the yard shows some of these trees, NW of the yard , 'foreshortened' by the angle of the camera so they seem closer? Plus some bushes pulled up since? (Or was the Google Earth aerial view taken in winter when there is less tree cover so thin trees won't all show up on an overhead shot ?) It's one possible solution .'

[FiveFanDownunder]

Hello Tim!

The site is a bit tricky! Thank you for your post.

Thinking about the many places we've been digging around regarding locations, this one has seen some of the biggest changes. Adds to the challenge and curiosity.

I was going to sit down yesterday and draw arrows over a site plan ( just like the good old days ) for Lepe Farm showing where I understood the different shots of Camp to have been taken, because it sounded like a good way to make sure I hadn't missed something obvious. This has happened before, most recently when trying to work out one of the 'walks' that MH had done as Julian in the upstairs of EH. Just didn't get to it.

In your last pic, if there's another 'wing' or barn coming back towards Adrian's camera, but rather on the northern side of the property, then this might end up supplying the glimpse of the corner seen in the shot.

I am hopeful of an aerial shot of the farm in the mid 70s can be found; it will hopefully answer the problem of the barn roof ( metal v asbestos ), gate, tree, mystery building, and might even show that the farm house has been extended/modified. If the shots of UQ are the house at Lepe, there's a very distinct roofline that does not match the current arrangement, and an attached garage with nearby shed to be spied.

[FiveFanDownunder]

Apologies for a double post, but the rest of the family is sleeping in, so now's the time.

There's a very helpful pan from close to north towards south, almost 180 degrees, with the camera located in the drive, close to the western end of the milking parlour. It's a night scene, so the filter is on, which is why I haven't spent enough time on it yet. Silly me.

Below shot is start of pan, looking NNE. The bare timber on the left side ( a partly demolished barn? ) is still present 2023. The open barn is visible above the white gate post, but there's a very interesting building ( not shown on the plans I have seen ) between them, running east west, with a roof that might match the glimpse seen in BH. By my reckoning, that building may turn a right angle and run north, as there's a roof line there, much too far north to be a continuation of the dutch barn. This is a big change from the modern photo. The gable in shadow at right of shot is the milking parlour.

Why exactly this building does not seem to be on the 1970s site plans is a mystery. The old ones seems based on Ordnance Maps, so maybe this building was not drawn on them??



The same spot ( more or less ) in 2023:



Halfway through the pan. Tractor has been moved in front of milking parlour. Existing N-S barn ( calf shed ) is present 2023 in middle of shot. Smaller buildings to right seem to have been demolished. Glimpse of long E-W building beyond house is seen in right of shot. This is now obscured by foliage in 2023.



And in 2023:



End of pan. Glimpse of north elevation of house. Windows ( four pane ) on this side are not a match for the shots of UQ and seem to match existing. But there are other buildings that are not visible here and for which I have not seen plans. There's a noticeable 'gap' between the outer and inner windows on the top floor that matches 2023. It is not possible to see the porch on the north side.



And in 2023. A bit leafy ..



Last of all, a similar view in 2012, the last streetview image with the barn in place. The metal roof is still a mystery ...

[timv]

You can also apparently see the now demolished 'big barn' at the NW end of the Lepe Farm farmyard in the 1978 episode of Five Go Off To Camp, at 8 minutes 01 secs to 8 mins 20 secs into the episode. George and Anne visit the farm near the campsite and we see a huge barn with tall posts and a high roof , with a tractor parked in the yard. The girls are walking past and to the left of the big barn - ie presumably walking NW to SE with the camera looking NW. There is some sort of red brick farm building to the left (South?) of the barn, with a door through which ?Jock comes out to talk to the girls, with his mother following. The barn is then behind her, so we are in one location for all of this. At 8 mins 26 secs the camera pans round to the right to give a view of the open space to the right (East?) of the barn, with a field and beyond that distant trees . If this is all Lepe Farm, which seems logical given what the barn looks like, then the first bit of the scene is looking NW to the 'demolished barn' and there is a lower building to its left, with a wide gap between them ; and as the camera pans to the NE we then see the view to the NE of the big barn, with trees and bushes etc.

The next shots are of the milking parlour, from 8 mins 50 secs to 9 mins, and we see inside this so we get a view of its size. Then we see a car drive out of the yard through a gateway into a road - presumably the main road from Exbury to Lepe, so this is a shot looking South. (You really need to have a map of the farm in front of you or to have been there to work this out; apologies to everyone who finds this complicated !)

These shots from Camp may give added info on what the Lepe Farm yard looked like in 1978, though as far as I can see we don't get any useful shots looking at the big barn (from SE to NW) from right across the yard by the house which show us the entire yard plus all the buildings around it .

[timv]

And this is a photo which Adrian has now sent me, from his ?2021 visit to Lepe Farm, showing the small barn to the South of the demolished big double barn out of which Jock comes in the 1978 Go Off To Camp episode's scene at the farm referred to in my previous post. Jock and his mother come out of the door here into the yard to talk to George and Anne; this pic is looking SW, ie the site of the demolished barn is off shot to the right . The scene in 1978 was looking from left to right in this pic, towards the big barn. As you can see, at the time of this pic the NW end of the yard was quite overgrown.

[FiveFanDownunder]

Thanks Tim and Adrian for the pic!

That door, can't miss it. Glad it's still there!

FFD

[timv]

A filmstill from the 1978 episode of Five Go Off To Camp, at 13 mins 25 seconds ff into the episode; this is the view of an upper floor window of the farmhouse at 'Jock's farm' just before Jock climbs out of it to join Julian and Dick to spy on the 'Mysterious Goings-On' . The layout of brickwork and roof gives us an indication that we're at Lepe Farmhouse - but which side of the house, the east/ SE (facing away from the yard) or the west/ NW (facing into the yard)? The triangular shape of the roof above indicates that we seem to be at the narrower end of a wing , and the main wing of the house runs from North/ NE to South/SW. So is this the 'end on' view of the N or the S end of the house?

[timv]

host images

A photo which Adrian unearthed of the SE corner of Lepe Farmhouse. The window out of which Jock climbs in the Five Go Off To Camp episode, at 13 mins 25 secs to 13 mins 38 secs, would appear to be the top window at the right in the main, red-brick part of the house; so the film of him climbing out of the window was done on this bit of lawn, looking North.

A few more clues as to location shots:

Lepe Farm yard -the shed where the crooks are hiding their lorries and bribing the farmer to keep quiet about this. At 10 mins, 3 secs into the episode we see the Five looking into the shed and spotting the lorries behind the door, before the farmer hastily intervenes; the camera is looking out of the shed as he approaches the children so we see across the yard. There is a longish, low shed with a corrugated iron? roof at the far side of the yard and trees behind this.. Then, at 10 mins 9 secs, the farmer's wife comes across the yard too and we get another view of the long, low shed behind her. Adrian has drawn up some notes of where the Lepe Farm shots appear to be taken, and I shall look through these and the yard plans.

The Go Off To Camp campsite on Blackwell Common - at 12 mins,4 secs to 12 mins, 30 secs, we have a view of the campsite and its tents, close to trees. We have a useful if short shot at 12 mins, 32 secs of a glimpse through a gap between the trees by the tents - and we can see a distant line of fir? trees which appear to be the woods on the far, ie SW, side of the Dark Water valley (beyond Gatewood Bridge) which we also see in the various shots of the children and Mr Luffy by the campsite. This confirms that the tents were put up on the main ridge of the Common, at the top of the hill from Gatewood Bridge and NE of the latter - as I have walked over with Adrian, Oliver, Elin, and Gary at various times. The site is now a lot clearer of trees than in 1978, but the shots of the camp give a good idea of where it was filmed within 50 yards or so.

As seen in the shot at 4 mins, 40 secs of Julian, George and Dick running off from the tents into the trees towards the stream - on level ground not down a slope - we do not seem to be near the edge of the 'drop' from the common to the valley, but at a spot with level ground both to the West (open heath, as seen behind Anne at 4 mins 31 secs) and to the SE (as seen in this shot of J, G and D). The camera seems to pan around in a natural movement from the tents to look into the trees, so it is probably - though we have to be careful with this assumption - all one sequence.

Would anyone local, eg at Exbury or Gatewood, have an idea as to when this bit of the Heath was cleared of trees??

[FiveFanDownunder]

Great Tim thanks!

How did you know I was just looking at Camp stuff ...? Had been wondering about some of the shots where George is running by herself over the 'moors' and finds the shaft/rabbit hole where she climbs down to the spook train tunnels.

I think I may have spotted a tree linking the site of the tunnel to Kirrin Island set ( large pipe ) at the bottom of the hill ( Kirren Island 1 ) to the spot where the children see more steam from the rail tunnels below the moor ( Camp 1 ), though it's hard to be 100% sure. I'll see if I can get a comparison shot up here soon.

Still looking for confirmation of Lepe Farm for the Dutch barn seen at end of BH - there seems to be a spanner in the works. I have removed colour and increased contrast and brightness to get a better look at the roof profile, and it appears that the barn in BH is a match for the structure at Lower Exbury ( though I'm not saying it's the same one, as the surrounds are different ). The BH barn seems to adjoin an awning/lean to, just as the structure in Lower Exbury does. This barn is also a match for the low masonry wall and the asbestos roof material.

The building behind UQ in the same set of shots might help. Do we know of such a building that almost matches the brickwork at Lepe Farm, with the same external black downpipes, two stories ( stairway can be seen behind Benny's Mum when UQ steps away from the door ) and an attached garage?? Must be very close to Exbury house ... the rest of that episode is 100% Exbury and I can't imagine the cast ( incl. Benny ) stepping too far away for 90 seconds of footage. Could be wrong about that of course.

So currently stumped and no closer to finding out what's going on. Still waiting on an aerial shot of Lepe Farm.


View from Camp Ep. 2 toward barns, black gables, twin barns.


View from BH toward barn, note roof ironwork shows single barn with lean to.

[FiveFanDownunder]

And just quickly, a tree linking Camp ( moors above the spook train tunnel ) and Kirrin Island ( entrance to secret way to Kirrin Island ). Note small spray of foliage low on main trunk and the 'offshoot' leaning to the right. Camp scenes shot quite close to it. I think we discussed this as the low side of the road to Blackfield ( opposite side to the Camp tent set up ) just up from the Gatewood Bridge?

[timv]

Adrian's marked up plan of Lepe Farm seen from above with the probable sites of various filmshots from Go Off To Camp , based on the Google Earth overhead view. Looking approximately North; the road is off shot to the bottom.

B is the shot from 10 mins, 9 secs in of the farmer's wife calling the Five to lunch as they are confronting her husband by the big double barn after they found the lorries hidden inside; this would indicate that the mysterious long, low shed with a corrugated iron roof behind her and the trees behind that are to the East/ NE of the double barn , and so appear to have been cleared since 1978.

G is the scene at 10 mins, 17 secs ff. of the children having tea in the farmhouse garden, with the porch to the rear.

I will see what I can find as to the exact layout of the big barn at Lower Exbury Farm, but a good view of this can be seen in its 1978 condition anyway in the Five Go Down To The Sea episode as bits of that were filmed there (though confusingly it was also filmed at Park Farm which also has extensive barns). The LEF barn is also a double one! In Part 2 of DTTS, at 4 mins 25 secs we have a shot of the Lower Exbury Farm barn (which runs from N to S with the long side of the oblong N to S, the short side E to W) from its SE corner, looking West past the farmhouse towards the mouth of the Beaulieu River - which we checked on our 2021 visit and which I checked independently on an earlier visit to the LE Farm art gallery. (The telegraph pole in the 1978 shots is still there too.) At 4 mins 27 secs in, the camera moves to the right (ie NW) onto the barn; Gary and Michelle are sitting on hay bales at the S end of the barn keeping an eye on Mr Penruthlan, and Marcus is to their right . Then we get a shot of Mr P humping bales in the barn, and at 4 mins 47 secs in the Guv'nor comes round the S end of the barn. The camera looks across him to the fields S of the farm and the sea beyond; this view is still the same as I checked in 2021.

These shots from Down To The Sea show the view of the Lower Exbury Farm barn in 1978 in detail, and also the view to its left across the fields in any shots of the barn that have the barn to the right. (At LEF, this is looking South). So you can compare these shots with the ones of the 'double barn' in Go Off To Camp, with the barn on the right, to see if the view is the same. I would think they are different, and that the (blurry) view of the far distance across the fields in the shots of the Camp double barn are of trees not of the open fields, sea, and Isle of Wight s the view would be if it was at Lower Exbury (and as it is in the Down To The Sea shots with the Guv'nor). This is my reckoning , anyway.

If it helps, the Lower Exbury barn in Down To The Sea has six large posts holding the roof up, the telegraph pole to the left, and a view into a lane beyond that - with no fence by the end of the barn, unlike in Camp.

[timv]

This is an aerial photo of Lower Exbury Farm, looking west, which Adrian has unearthed; you get a good view of the barn and can compare its roof with the one in the Five Go Off To Camp and Five Go Down to The Sea shots which I have referred to. You can also see the telegraph pole to the left (South) of the barn. The yard where the camera was standing for the shots of the Five keeping an eye on Mr Penruthlan as he piles up hay-bales is below the barn in this view, ie to the East; this is where we parked on our visits to the farm, and ditto myself and my companion on our visit to the art gallery (now situated in the sheds further up the pic , round the yard). This is an old view taken before the inner yard West of/ above the barn was tidied up. The long shed which appears to have been used for the 'Barnies' show preparations in the Tremannon farm barn' scenes in the Go Down To The Sea episode is the one running right to left (N to S) at the West/ top of the inner yard; but we now think that this was not the 'TF barn' where the children emerge from the Wreckers Way with Yan as that was filmed at Park Farm.

There is an open entrance to the yard East of /below the big barn, not one with a fence and gate, and there are no trees nearby - one argument against this being the barn in the Go Off To Camp scenes.

For reference, the sea is off shot to the left ie South, across open fields; the Beaulieu River is beyond the farmhouse which is to the West of the yard and sheds, at the top of the pic.

[timv]

A note on the opening of the 1978 Five On Finniston Farm episode, which may help in the long-running question of the location of the opening shots - 48 secs to 1 minute into the episode. I had a look at the farm location, ie St Leonards Farm near Beaulieu, yesterday - and saw an eagle too for good measure, high up in the sky over the fields between St L and the Beaulieu River and keeping well clear of the road and any cars/ people. As the children walk into Finniston Farmyard, aka St Leonards, walking West to East past the main farm courtyard of buildings towards the drive and big barn, their shadows are behind them - they were filmed in late afternoon or early evening as the sun must be in the West.

The contentious opening shots of them crossing a gap (with a wooden plank 'bridge' over what appears to be a ditch) between two hedges, next to a big oak tree, has their shadows behind them too, as the camera looks at them - with their shadows stretching into the field on the far side of the gap. So the camera is looking West; and when Gary/ Dick points past the camera towards the farm buildings and the next shot shows a view of them, the view is that from the first hedge-gap in the fields to the West of St Leonards Farm. The shadows are the same as in the previous shot, ie facing East (towards the farm); so this would seem to be one of those occasion where the successive shots were filmed in sequence at the same time, within minutes at most, at the same location.

This argues for the opening shot being at the first hedge-gap West of the farm, about 100 yards west of the farm and somewhere N of the road from St Leonards West to Sowley Pond. It is not possible to be exact where this was done on the hedge's North-South line as the fields may have been altered since 1978 by running two smaller fields together. The hedge in the left distance in the opening shot as we look West, ie to the South of the field to the West of the hedge-gap, may be either the road hedge (of the road running West from St L to Sowley Pond) or a now pulled-up hedge within what is now a larger field. If it is the road hedge, the view was more open in 1978 than it is now, but that is a common problem for the series. The shadows and their directions do make it seem probable that this is the correct spot, rather than one on the East side of the St L Farm corner in the fields of Salternshill Farm where if we were looking West we would see not a wide open field but the view up a slight slope towards St Leonards which is on a low hill and would have a long hedge (that of the St L to Bucklers Hard road) visible from this angle if we looked West.

If anyone wants to get a good look at the layout, check the Google Earth map view of St Leonards (on the West side of the Beaulieu river from Exbury). The map looks North as upwards; the children approach the farm from above (North of) the line of road coming from Sowley/ Thorns Farm, past the Park Farm drive.