Back in Time for Dinner/the Weekend/School

[Katharine]

I'm wondering how people eat battered fish without any cutlery?

For those of you feeling nostalgic about old style kitchens, maybe you'd like to buy this house?

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for ... 16824.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If I had the money I'd be seriously considering putting in a bid myself, and probably the only thing I'd change in the kitchen would be to remove the brown louver doors. It's sad to think that in a few month's time it will probably be back on the market with replacement windows and a modern kitchen. Another piece of the past lost forever. Although I have to admit I don't think I could live with bright pink bannisters for very long.

[Moonraker]

I'm wondering how people eat battered fish without any cutlery?

You pinch the fish between your thumb and forefinger, Katharine!

[Courtenay]

Thanks, Nigel - couldn't have said it better myself.

[Moonraker]

Haha! You'd make a great dinner-date, old thing!

[Katharine]

And just lift the whole piece of fish to your mouth?

[Courtenay]

And just lift the whole piece of fish to your mouth?

Oh no, you pull off bite-size pieces one at a time, unless it's a small piece of fish to start with.

Haha! You'd make a great dinner-date, old thing!

I'll let you know when I'm next in Salisbury. (I was going to suggest we should have fish and chips, but I'm remembering my dad's maxim: never have fish and chips in an inland town.)

[Katharine]

Thanks Courtenay, I've learned something new there.

I've just started watching the 1960s programme, I love the look of the kitchen, and was interested in the comment about the new lay out of the kitchen. The expert ought to come and see my kitchen which was fitted new just before we bought it in 2001. I think the layout is dreadful. I'm always traipsing backwards and forwards from the sink to the cooker, preparing vegetables usually results in the floor sopping wet. The work surfaces are split into three small areas, so never enough room for baking or preparing food. I'd much rather have an old-fashioned kitchen with a table in the middle and the cooker next to the sink.

Also the only place for the fridge freezer is next to some floor cupboards, so although it's possible to open the doors fully, it's impossible to actually stand in front of them to look inside, so the only way I can get things out from the back is to bend sideways and locate things by feeling for them. So much for 'progress'

[Katharine]

Ok, so I'm 10 minutes into the programme, and not sure I can watch any more. The woman is making a fuss about opening a tin of corned beef as if the key on the side is something alien and old-fashioned. They still open like that in the year 2015.

Interesting to see a toaster is now considered standard, my parents didn't have one until about 1980 I think it was, and then it was a present. I don't remember their kitchen from the 1960s, but it definitely wouldn't have been a fitted one.

If I can bear to watch any more the 1970s one will be particularly interesting, as I expect it will have very little resemblance to my own childhood.

[Katharine]

I decided to start watching the 1950s programme instead, and did have some sympathy for the lady and the tin opener. I've never used one like that, and don't ever remember my parents using one either, we always had a 'butterfly' one. A 'real' woman of that generation would obviously have been used to seeing how it was used. I was a bit surprised by the comment one of her daughters made about not knowing how to open a modern tin. I'm not quite sure how old she is, but as the boy is 10, I'd guess she's about 13, mine would certainly know how to open a tin by that age, even if they'd never opened one themselves, they'd have seen their parents opening one.

I couldn't understand why the liver wasn't served with gravy either, it's simple enough to make. I was horrified to see the mother pick up the raw liver, put it into the pan and then hold the spoon to stir it with without washing her hands.

I thought the evening meal of bread and tinned pilchards was perfectly normal, we don't eat dripping in our house, but apart from that, it's a meal we'd often have ourselves, in fact we had pilchards on bread at the weekend.

I'm always a bit sceptical about these programmes which talk about the way people lived. The idea of men being kept out of the kitchen for example, I know my grandfather used to dry up from time to time, and I've a feeling he would also cook breakfast sometimes. The only reason he didn't do more around the house was that he had three allotments to tend, plus he kept chickens, and that was on top of working full time. He used to have to cycle to work too, so it wasn't a case of being sexist, he simply didn't have time to do any more domestic chores.

OK, how on earth did that woman get a job as a teacher, she doesn't seem to have two brain cells to rub together, she couldn't even bake a simple cake without it being soggy in the middle! And why on earth did she serve the kids cold left overs from lunch? Although that seems a bit odd, surely children went home for dinner in those days? Even if for some reason they couldn't, the obvious thing to do would be to cook their meal from scratch. We often have liver for dinner, but I don't think I'd ever expect my family to eat it cold, or if for some reason they had to, at least the rest of the meal would be hot.

[Fiona1986]

Ok I'm going to come in here and defend this poor woman (after everyone seems to have criticised her thoroughly) I watched it the 60s ep this week and well to tell you the truth I'm not sure I could have done any better. I wouldn't know where to start with a tin with a key to open it. My cakes always come out rather flat and sometimes a bit biscuity. I can cook plenty of meals but I'm unfamiliar with 50s and 60s recipes and so wouldn't automatically find it easy.

[Katharine]

Fiona, your comments are interesting, and dare I say, rather worrying. There's so much evidence that diet is linked to health problems, behaviour problems etc., and yet today's younger people don't seem to be able to cope with food that doesn't come straight from a packet, laden with sugar and additives. OK, it's perfectly possible to go through the whole of life without ever opening a tin of corned beef, but this woman so far seems at a loss to cook anything, although admittedly I haven't watched the whole programme yet.

Also, the basic hygiene of dripping blood from meat everywhere was alarming, and this from a more mature supposedly educated woman. Presumably if she's a teacher she has a degree, what did she live on for three years at university? Although I do think it's unfair to expect her to reproduce the Coronation cake. I'm pretty sure my grandmother wouldn't have been able to find anyone on her Council estate with a fridge to set a jelly in, and I would have thought that design was rather ambitious for the average housewife.

I guess I must live in some kind of bubble, as I find it beyond my comprehension to hear children on programmes like these talking about how hard they find life without crisps, sweets and takeaways. Those foods simply don't feature in my family's daily life. Sure we have them from time to time, but they aren't an every day feature.

I would love to know what 'normal' people eat on a regular basis, someone I know managed to live for months with only a microwave and no oven.

[walter raleigh]

The obvious riposte to that Katharine is to ask what exactly is 'normal' anyway?

For example on the subject of food, as a child I used to hate going to eat at other people's houses as nobody cooked food like my mother did. My father used to say she was the best cook he ever knew and of course the way she cooked food was the way I liked it.

Going to neighbours or friends for Sunday lunch was a particular horror as I'd be subjected to soggy vegetables, roast potatoes that weren't crispy on the outside and fluffy on the inside, and worst of all everything smothered in gravy! I also remember the ticking off I got from one friends father for putting ketchup on my roast dinner, something that was perfectly 'normal' at home!

The point is we all have different domestic customs and standards, and I don't think there is a 'right' way to prepare food, although I accept there are probably a few wrong ways - not washing your hands after handling raw meat is definitely ill-advised.

[Katharine]

What a lovely thing to say about your mum's cooking, and also lovely to hear your dad appreciated it too.

I must admit though, I'd have been a bit upset if someone had put tomato sauce on a roast dinner that I'd cooked for them. I'd take it as a bit of an insult, as I'd assume that they didn't like the flavour and wanted to disguise it. Although presumably there must have been the sauce on the table so I would question why it was there if they didn't want it to be used?

I never had that problem as a child though, I only remember eating at someone else's house two or three times, and I think that was only because my parents had to attend funerals. Apart from family gatherings such as Easter or birthdays when we'd have a celebration tea I don't recall people eating at our house, or us going round anyone else's, certainly not for a cooked meal. Don't know why, it just wasn't something that happened, I find it hard nowadays that it's expected to feed children if they come round to play with mine.

I don't think there's anything wrong with different domestic customs and standards, apart from ensuring that people have a balanced diet. I sometimes see parents doing the school 'run' with toddlers in pushchairs eating things like Cheesy Wotsits, and wonder if such a diet will have any detrimental effect on their health in later years.

I'm wondering what the family in this programme normally have for breakfast, as so far they seem to have turned their noses up at toast, cereal and bacon for breakfast - what else is there left to have? I wonder if the final programme will show what they eat during a 'normal' day'?

[Julie2owlsdene]

I'm just wondering where they get some of these people from to appear in things of this sort for TV. I'm sorry but the mother is clearly not the brightest person to have on this programme as she struggles too much. It really will be interesting to know exactly how old she is?

Maybe she was chosen from a large group, and they picked the person who would get on our nerves the most. Maybe someone else in the group, would have been perfect and so the producers thought they wouldn't make it so entertaining!!

[Katharine]

With a 15 year old daughter, I would assume she is at least 40.

I wonder just how much of their struggles are choreographed by the production company. If she's never cooked liver before, why didn't she choose a day that had food she was familiar with?

Also, I find it frustrating that from my point of view they never seem to focus on the class of people I'm familiar with. In the 1960s programme they head off out for a meal in their car. I think it said that about 30% of families owned a car, well that means two thirds of the population DIDN'T own one, so it's not a very realistic portrayal of 'normal' family life then.

Also, Rochelle is Jewish, so unfamiliar with cooking bacon, just how many people in the UK were Jewish in the 1950s? Surely not a very accurate portrayal of a family from that time.