Journal 63

What did you think of the latest Journal?
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Tony Summerfield
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Re: Journal 63

Post by Tony Summerfield »

Moonraker wrote:Sadly, I missed Courtenay's Controversy post, but I imagine it referred to spoilers. Yes, I am not a great over of plot summaries disguised as reviews, but I still found Angela Canning's article to be a good read. Thrashing's a-plenty certainly seemed to be the ordre du jour!
Eleven minutes after this post, came another post from a recently registered new member.
Angela Canning wrote:Thank you
Over the past two and a half months these forums have been plagued by probable spammers who have been trying to register and we have already had to delete about three hundred. Every potential newcomer has to be checked and it is a time consuming nuisance.

I do not know who 'Angela Canning' is as this is the first post 'she' has made. I do know that it is not the Angela Canning who is a long-standing member of the Society, who writes regular articles in the Journal. It is clearly somebody who is a frequent visitor to the forums who has registered under the name Angela Canning, but before we get welcoming posts I thought you should know that this person is not who you think they are.

Hopefully whoever this is will come clean and own up, even if it is only an apology to me in a PM.
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Rob Houghton
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Re: Journal 63

Post by Rob Houghton »

Tony Summerfield wrote: I do not know who 'Angela Canning' is as this is the first post 'she' has made. I do know that it is not the Angela Canning who is a long-standing member of the Society, who writes regular articles in the Journal. It is clearly somebody who is a frequent visitor to the forums who has registered under the name Angela Canning, but before we get welcoming posts I thought you should know that this person is not who you think they are.

Hopefully whoever this is will come clean and own up, even if it is only an apology to me in a PM.
I'm glad you mentioned this, Tony - as I thought it was extremely odd that Angela Canning was mentioned on 13 July and the very next minute 'she' had become a member on the same day! I thought it was a bit suspicious! :x
'Oh voice of Spring of Youth
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I'll warm me with your echoes
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John Pickup
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Re: Journal 63

Post by John Pickup »

Carrying on with my journal read I came to Rob's article which I assumed was to be about the food in the books. I was pleasantly surprised to read his take on a Magic Pudding and, indeed, it did turn out to be a tasty dish. I'm looking forward to savouring the Adventure Cake and Mystery Tart next.
Cover Stories by John Lester I found extremely interesting. We all have our favourite dustwrappers, my personal choice would have Rubadub Mystery at No 1. Those long shadows are just so dramatic.
Sheila Ray's article was fascinating with her views on inspirations for Enid's work. I particularly enjoyed reading about her research work and her meetings with Gillian and Imogen.
Looking at the colour covers of Treasure Island in the centre pages confirmed my conviction that Eileen Soper's were the best. Those last two for the 2015 and 2017 editions are dreadful although I quite like the ones from 1987 and 1993.
I hope to complete the journal over the next two days but I have renewed my subscription so the next three journals are safely in the bag.
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Rob Houghton
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Re: Journal 63

Post by Rob Houghton »

John Pickup wrote: Looking at the colour covers of Treasure Island in the centre pages confirmed my conviction that Eileen Soper's were the best. Those last two for the 2015 and 2017 editions are dreadful although I quite like the ones from 1987 and 1993.
I agree, of course! I must admit I find it really odd how just over the space of two or three years children's tastes have changed so drastically. All the covers have great human figures on the front until just two or three years ago, and then everything changed! Apparently children's tastes just changed over night! :shock:
'Oh voice of Spring of Youth
hearts mad delight,
Sing on, sing on, and when the sun is gone
I'll warm me with your echoes
through the night.'

(E. Blyton, Sunday Times, 1951)



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Chrissie777
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Re: Journal 63

Post by Chrissie777 »

Rob Houghton wrote: All the covers have great human figures on the front until just two or three years ago, and then everything changed! Apparently children's tastes just changed over night!
To me they look like cheaply drawn cartoons. But not the fancy cartoons from the forties and fifties like "Prince Valiant" by Hal Foster. Rather like something children could draw. I wonder if that's what is so popular about these illustrations?
My two step-grandsons want books all the time, American books for children by new authors about whom I've never heard. They have similarly odd looking covers.
I think we were spoiled with beautiful, artistic covers and illustrations by Soper, Tresilian, Dunlop and E. H. Davie to name a few.
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Rob Houghton
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Re: Journal 63

Post by Rob Houghton »

I know I keep saying this about the modern covers, but I really can't understand it. I can understand that maybe half of todays children like the new covers...but apparently most of them do! When I was a child the covers I went for were always artistic and well drawn, dramatic, and had human-proportioned figures.

I know many people dislike the Betty Maxey covers etc - but if we are honest, every Famous Five cover ever produced was a piece of artwork - until the last couple! :shock:
'Oh voice of Spring of Youth
hearts mad delight,
Sing on, sing on, and when the sun is gone
I'll warm me with your echoes
through the night.'

(E. Blyton, Sunday Times, 1951)



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Chrissie777
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Re: Journal 63

Post by Chrissie777 »

Rob Houghton wrote: I know many people dislike the Betty Maxey covers etc - but if we are honest, every Famous Five cover ever produced was a piece of artwork - until the last couple! :shock:
No, I don't dislike Betty Maxey. It's just that I grew up with Eileen A. Soper in the mid 1960's+. The German FF covers by Nikoalus Plump were not to my liking, but the inside illustrations by Soper were just gorgeous and still are to me that way. Same with Tresilian or Dunlap.
Then around 1995 I started collecting the FF in old red English hardcovers and was thrilled to finally have Soper covers.

Yes, the children's books illustrations way back in the 1940's, 1950's and 1960's were definitely pieces of artwork. 8) There were lots of excellent illustrators out there, also in the US, in France and in Germany.
I wonder if the publishing houses didn't want to pay much for illustrators anymore and from there it went down hill?
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Carlotta King
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Re: Journal 63

Post by Carlotta King »

Rob Houghton wrote:I know I keep saying this about the modern covers, but I really can't understand it. I can understand that maybe half of todays children like the new covers...but apparently most of them do! When I was a child the covers I went for were always artistic and well drawn, dramatic, and had human-proportioned figures.
Same here. I always really loved covers that were realistic and had lots of lovely detail and looked like proper artwork.

I wonder if today's kids prefer the cartoony covers because pretty much everything is cartoony these days and there's not really much choice otherwise?
These days everything seems to be cartoony everywhere you look. All the kids films are animated and there seem to be hundreds of them all the time, and most of them seem to be these mis-proportioned 'big head skinny body' style, whether they're 3d animated like Frozen etc or flat 2d style (can't think of an example but I mean like the old Disney style, just normal cartoon).
Then all the toys seem to be cartoony too, I'm thinking of Bratz dolls and there seem to be tons of other dolls made in cartoony style too, whenever I look in the Argos catalogue there seem to be pages of dolls with big heads and big eyes and cartoon style features, can't think of any names off the top of my head but none of them are real looking.

I know there were obviously cartoons about years ago as well. I didn't watch much TV as a child, I was always either reading or writing or drawing or outside, so I can't comment on exactly how many cartoons there were in those days, but I'm sure there weren't as many as there are nowadays, we really seem to be swamped with animated stuff everywhere.

So perhaps kids like these covers because that style is literally everywhere you look and they don't know any different? Its in every shop, and every type of toy or book or film.
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Rob Houghton
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Re: Journal 63

Post by Rob Houghton »

Yes, I tend to agree, Carlotta. I think children usually only like what they're exposed to - and if they were exposed to realistic dramatic pieces of artwork, they would like those just as much, if not better, than the out-of-proportion figures they are always presented with.

All of us, even as adults, only like what we know. That's an obvious statement - but i mean until we are exposed to new things we can only appreciate what we already know. Its a pity children aren't helped into a wider appreciation of art and music and film these days. the reason I like old movies and Enid Blyton and artistic illustrations and old music - in fact anything from Gilbert ad Sullivan to 1930's band music to 1950's, 60's, 70's, 80's etc is that I was exposed to a wide range of influences growing up. It seems these days that children experience only a very narrow sample of what is out there, and they rarely expand beyond those experiences all their life!
Last edited by Rob Houghton on 20 Jul 2017, 13:49, edited 1 time in total.
'Oh voice of Spring of Youth
hearts mad delight,
Sing on, sing on, and when the sun is gone
I'll warm me with your echoes
through the night.'

(E. Blyton, Sunday Times, 1951)



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Julie2owlsdene
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Re: Journal 63

Post by Julie2owlsdene »

I guess times change, Robert, and even if we don't want to, we have to move with the times. I think it is also what the parents of children these days let them have access too.

When my daughter was young she was exposed to the old Blyton covers, old B&W films, plays etc. And she still likes old B&W films, plays, etc, but never took to Blyton, sadly.

When my grandkids come to their grandma's. They're exposed to all my Blyton books, dust jackets, old films I love to watch and they sit and watch with me. And my middle grandson is just fascinated by the old Blyton dust jackets. :D

8)
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Chrissie777
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Re: Journal 63

Post by Chrissie777 »

Rob Houghton wrote:All of us, even as adults, only like what we know. That's an obvious statement - but i mean until we are exposed to new things we can only appreciate what we already know. Its a pity children aren't helped into a wider appreciation of art and music and film these days. the reason I like old movies and Enid Blyton and artistic illustrations and old music - in fact anything from Gilbert ad Sullivan to 1930's band music to 1950's, 60's, 70's, 80's etc is that I was exposed to a wide range of influences growing up. It seems these days that children experience only a very narrow sample of what is out there, and they rarely expand beyond those experiences all their life!
Hi Carlotta and Rob,

Carlotta, I very much enjoyed reading your post. 8)
If I may be nosy and ask: where have you been? I didn't read anything posted on EBS by you for quite a while.

Regarding "All of us only like what we know": my parents tried VERY VERY hard in vain to get me interested in reading classics like "The Little Prince" or "Nils Holgersson". I read them, but didn't like them, because they were not as suspenseful as EB or Norman Dale or Astrid Lindgren's "Bill Bergson" or "Seacrow Island".
So already as a 10 year old child I was picky. I read their classics to please them, but read much more of EB which annoyed them.

That's what I thought, too. Children are only exposed to what they watch on TV (which in the US is VERY limited: animation and science docus for kids, "Lassie" one episode per week on Saturdays), what their parents get them for birthday/Christmas and what their teachers tell them about at school. And that doesn't seem to be much. :roll:
And the children's book section at Barnes & Noble really doesn't offer much variety: Nancy Drew, Hardy Boys, some classics like "Tom Sawyer" and "Robinson Crusoe", "Little House on the Prairie" and other stories for American girls about the West in the past, "Harry Potter", books on magic and lots of new books with cartoon-like covers, mostly spy stories or dramas in the family (probably for the many kids who experience their parents getting divorced).

My point is: there are almost no adventures!!! :cry:
No escapism reading.
I always thought that adventure stories are timeless and thus must appeal to children, but to me it seems these past two children's books decades have been turning their back on adventure stories for kids more and more (sorry if my grammar is not correct, my husband finally found a way to turn off the automated translating system on my computer and now I don't have to re-correct back so many words when I'm typing in German :D :D :D ).
I'm so glad not to be a child today...it would be soooo very boring. :roll:

And what happened to those inspirational teachers that we used to have?
Chrissie

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John Pickup
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Re: Journal 63

Post by John Pickup »

I've now completed my journal and I believe it is one of the best I have read in my time as a subscriber.
Although I have never seen the Secret Series I found Nick Hopkin's article very informative, especially the part about the adaptations.
The story about Prince Furious was quite funny. Usually, I would gloss over a story like this but, to my surprise, I quite enjoyed it.
Was Enid A Dame Slap? Probably not in the literal sense. But, as Angela Canning reveals, her reference from Bickley Park shows her interest in children and her method in dealing with them meant there was no occasion for using the slipper.
The article about Chris Poole's letter and the subsequent detective work by Tony was very interesting. A very observant lad indeed. It is always nice to see copies of Enid's letters and I like the P.S. written sideways on to the main text.
But, with all due respect to the other contributors, my favourite article was Daisy's fascinating conclusion to Anne Kirrin's Journal. I loved Part 1 and the continuing saga throughout the years was expertly done. I had to hold back from jumping ahead but the innovative way she tied up the loose ends and introduced us to the very beginning of Fanny and Quentin's lives was fascinating. And we discover that Fanny met Quentin before 1909. Wonderful Daisy, thank you. I don't suppose that you have access to any of Fanny's journals by any chance?
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Re: Journal 63

Post by Daisy »

Thank you so much for your appreciative comments John. I have heard that recently Fanny unearthed a dusty old box from the attic which contained a bundle of letters..... :wink:
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Tony Summerfield
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Re: Journal 63

Post by Tony Summerfield »

Tony Summerfield wrote:Over the past two and a half months these forums have been plagued by probable spammers who have been trying to register and we have already had to delete about three hundred. Every potential newcomer has to be checked and it is a time consuming nuisance.

I do not know who 'Angela Canning' is as this is the first post 'she' has made. I do know that it is not the Angela Canning who is a long-standing member of the Society, who writes regular articles in the Journal. It is clearly somebody who is a frequent visitor to the forums who has registered under the name Angela Canning, but before we get welcoming posts I thought you should know that this person is not who you think they are.

Hopefully whoever this is will come clean and own up, even if it is only an apology to me in a PM.
I have waited a couple of days in the hope that I was going to get a PM about this so that I would be able to draw a line under it privately, but as nothing has been forthcoming I am going to have deal with this for all to see.

I would like Sixret to explain to us why she has both registered and posted in this thread as Angela Canning. :roll:
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Re: Journal 63

Post by sixret »

Spot on! :wink:

Apologies for that. :D
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