Mountain of Adventure
Mountain of Adventure
I am re-reading the Adventure series again. In Mountain there is a particularly disturbing passage, where Lucy-Ann finds a tree, where a black man is hiding.
She got a terrible shock. Looking down at her was a face - and it was black! The little girl sat there, petrified.......saw that the face was topped by black, wooly hair, and had very white teeth and thick lips. "It's a negro!" she thought to herself......
The black face looked down...and then the thick lips parted in a smile. The woollen head nodded amiably.....
"You not make a sound little missy," said the negro...."I poor nigger....but poor nigger nowhere to go...."
Am I, who vehemently defends keeping the original wording, alone in finding this passage disturbing?
She got a terrible shock. Looking down at her was a face - and it was black! The little girl sat there, petrified.......saw that the face was topped by black, wooly hair, and had very white teeth and thick lips. "It's a negro!" she thought to herself......
The black face looked down...and then the thick lips parted in a smile. The woollen head nodded amiably.....
"You not make a sound little missy," said the negro...."I poor nigger....but poor nigger nowhere to go...."
Am I, who vehemently defends keeping the original wording, alone in finding this passage disturbing?
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I have just checked the passage in a Piper (Macmillan) p/back (Pan 1988).
She saw that the face was topped by black, thick hair, and had bright eyes and a cheerful expression.
"Don't you make a sound, l'il gal," said the man...He sounded American! "Don't you say I'm here. I'm just a poor man, lost and alone."......."But this poor fellah's gotten no place to go..."
No mention now of woolly hair, negros and niggers; but from there on, he is referred to as 'the American'.
Is this a change for the better?
I rather think it is (although I am pleased that I have the original).
She saw that the face was topped by black, thick hair, and had bright eyes and a cheerful expression.
"Don't you make a sound, l'il gal," said the man...He sounded American! "Don't you say I'm here. I'm just a poor man, lost and alone."......."But this poor fellah's gotten no place to go..."
No mention now of woolly hair, negros and niggers; but from there on, he is referred to as 'the American'.
Is this a change for the better?
I rather think it is (although I am pleased that I have the original).
Last edited by Moonraker on 07 Aug 2006, 10:56, edited 1 time in total.
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Remember that this was written in the 1940s Nigel and certainly wouldn't be written today. Rather suprisingly though I have just checked updates and he was still a poor nigger in 1985!
In a more recent version he is described as an American (from his accent) and he has black, thick hair with bright eyes and a cheerful expression. He was a poor 'man' and he kept addressing Lucy-Ann as 'l'il girl'
This has got to be an example where a change is sensible, but you must treat the original as being from the period it was written in - I have seen similar language from other children's authors from the same period - W.E.Johns for example.
Best wishes
Tony
In a more recent version he is described as an American (from his accent) and he has black, thick hair with bright eyes and a cheerful expression. He was a poor 'man' and he kept addressing Lucy-Ann as 'l'il girl'
This has got to be an example where a change is sensible, but you must treat the original as being from the period it was written in - I have seen similar language from other children's authors from the same period - W.E.Johns for example.
Best wishes
Tony
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I agree that this scene makes me squirm, but I don't see it as particularly out of the ordinary for the period in which it was published. I mean, any such comments seem inappropriate in retrospect, but it doesn't make me think Enid Blyton was a particularly racist person for her time.
The only problem with this change from "negro" to "American" (with no mention of him being a black American that I recall) is that the preceding scene with David becomes even stranger than before.
David, the Welsh guide, sees something and freaks out. He cowers on the ground with his hands over his face and shouts, "Black, black, black!" Moments later he's off, "speeding" down the mountain with most of the donkeys.
It makes some kind of sense that he's frightened because in those days, in the remote Welsh mountains, it's conceivable that David's never seen a black man before. But these days such a thing would be hard to believe, and with the change from "negro" to "American" the whole "black, black, black!" thing is nothing but confusing. You'd think that the publishers, while changing the character from a negro to an American, would think to change David's frightened exclaimations as well -- perhaps to something like, "Yank! Yank! Yank!" (enough to give anyone the willies).
The only problem with this change from "negro" to "American" (with no mention of him being a black American that I recall) is that the preceding scene with David becomes even stranger than before.
David, the Welsh guide, sees something and freaks out. He cowers on the ground with his hands over his face and shouts, "Black, black, black!" Moments later he's off, "speeding" down the mountain with most of the donkeys.
It makes some kind of sense that he's frightened because in those days, in the remote Welsh mountains, it's conceivable that David's never seen a black man before. But these days such a thing would be hard to believe, and with the change from "negro" to "American" the whole "black, black, black!" thing is nothing but confusing. You'd think that the publishers, while changing the character from a negro to an American, would think to change David's frightened exclaimations as well -- perhaps to something like, "Yank! Yank! Yank!" (enough to give anyone the willies).
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Nigel and I were posting at the same time here, so our posts are a bit repetitive - but neither of us made clear that he is still referred to throughout as a black man and that is the reason given for explaining David's outburst, but the word 'American' is used instead of negro. His words are altered to how some editor at Macmillan's thinks an American would speak!!!
'I've been in that there bad mountain l'il gal. I've gotten away. But this poor fellah's gotten no place to go - and he's surely scared by those big dogs. I'm staying here in this nice big tree. You git away, l'il gal, you git far away!'
Over to you Keith, has the editor done her homework okay?!!
Best wishes
Tony
'I've been in that there bad mountain l'il gal. I've gotten away. But this poor fellah's gotten no place to go - and he's surely scared by those big dogs. I'm staying here in this nice big tree. You git away, l'il gal, you git far away!'
Over to you Keith, has the editor done her homework okay?!!
Best wishes
Tony
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Oh, he was a black American? I can't remember, and I don't have the new editions any more.
As for his American accent... well, I can only guess what he might have said iffen he was from around these here parts (north Georgia):
"Ah've bin in that there bad mountain, l'il gal. Ah got away -- but this poor fellah's got no place to go, an' he's dang scairt o' them big dawgs. Ah'm-a-stayin right here in this nice big tree, yessum. Now, you might oughta git far away, l'il gal, afore it's too late. You git far, far away -- y'unnerstan?"
As for his American accent... well, I can only guess what he might have said iffen he was from around these here parts (north Georgia):
"Ah've bin in that there bad mountain, l'il gal. Ah got away -- but this poor fellah's got no place to go, an' he's dang scairt o' them big dawgs. Ah'm-a-stayin right here in this nice big tree, yessum. Now, you might oughta git far away, l'il gal, afore it's too late. You git far, far away -- y'unnerstan?"
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To see what Blyton really thought of black Americans, see "The Queen Elizabeth Family" where she describes meeting all sorts of them on her one trip to New York. She knew that most of her English readers had never met a black person, and she tells them that they are nice.
As I recall, Sam the brave Negro Marine, goes on to invent hang gliding!
Best wishes
Viv
As I recall, Sam the brave Negro Marine, goes on to invent hang gliding!
Best wishes
Viv
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I remember reading this just a few years ago (and I'm in my twenties!!!) and I didn't pick up on the fact that the man was black at all!! (Maybe I just read too literally...) As it's not mentioned, I just assumed he was a white man with black hair! I think I had to infer it from the book overall but I remember it hindered my visualisation of the story! Till this day, I still can't really picture the character...moonraker wrote: She saw that the face was topped by black, thick hair, and had bright eyes and a cheerful expression.
"Don't you make a sound, l'il gal," said the man...He sounded American! "Don't you say I'm here. I'm just a poor man, lost and alone."......."But this poor fellah's gotten no place to go..."
No mention now of woolly hair, negros and niggers; but from there on, he is referred to as 'the American'.
Not being black, perhaps it's hard for me to say whether or not what was originally written was racist or not. I personally don't feel it was. I seem to remember that saying "black" or "negro" was more acceptable than the term "nigger". And having said that, from something totally unrelated (!!), in the comedy Rush Hour, when Chris Tucker says "What's up, my nigger?" to a fellow black, it is acceptable - two minutes later when Jackie Chan says it to the same man - all chaos ensued!
Steve, an interesting point on text alterations in other books! What about other books like Huckleberry Finn, where black slaves feature quite prominently? Do the modern editors change the authors' descriptions if they consider it derogatory or non-PC - bearing in mind they regard these authors as classics (and Enid Blyton's work as not)?
TT
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If you advocate keeping the original texts then there should be no exceptions, otherwise there is no point.
When I read a book by Enid Blyton I find myself getting into a 1950s "mind-set" - I never make comparisons with today's world. I just enjoy the book for what it is - essentially an historical novel. I am not in the least offended by the extract quoted in the first post, but then, I am one of the least politically correct people you could wish to find!
Incidentally, Mountain was always my favourite of the 'Adventure' series - a minority choice, I know!
When I read a book by Enid Blyton I find myself getting into a 1950s "mind-set" - I never make comparisons with today's world. I just enjoy the book for what it is - essentially an historical novel. I am not in the least offended by the extract quoted in the first post, but then, I am one of the least politically correct people you could wish to find!
Incidentally, Mountain was always my favourite of the 'Adventure' series - a minority choice, I know!
Mountain of Adventure
eI agree totally with Bill Smugs, that reading Blyton novels today is reading historical fiction. I thoroughly enjoy picking out the "dated" aspects of these books. Of course I'm a huge fan of the antique world.
A really good example of rewriting text in series books is that of Nancy Drew whose books were "updated" several times. I have always been a collector of this series and strive to get the most original text I can.
I was actually unaware that Blyton books had the text modernized as I refuse to buy ones without illustrations and had found that the newer ones, especially in the Adventure series (my all time favorite Blytons) did not have those wonderful illustrations by Stuart Tresilian.
A really good example of rewriting text in series books is that of Nancy Drew whose books were "updated" several times. I have always been a collector of this series and strive to get the most original text I can.
I was actually unaware that Blyton books had the text modernized as I refuse to buy ones without illustrations and had found that the newer ones, especially in the Adventure series (my all time favorite Blytons) did not have those wonderful illustrations by Stuart Tresilian.
My name is Nancy and I have been a Blyton fan since the age of 10 when my brother offered me his copy of The Island of Adventure. That was 45 years ago!
Bill Smugs wrote:If you advocate keeping the original texts then there should be no exceptions, otherwise there is no point.
When I read a book by Enid Blyton I find myself getting into a 1950s "mind-set" - I never make comparisons with today's world. I just enjoy the book for what it is - essentially an historical novel.
Yes, I always strongly agreed with this opinion. However, on reading Mountain, I thought, perhaps this should be altered.
All of us over a certain age do get into a "1950s "mind-set"", but don't forget, the books are now primarily on the shelves for today's children - who are in a 21st century "mind-set". I don't really see Mountain of Adventure as an historical novel though, even if it was written 57 years ago. I'm certain kids today don't think they are reading history!
Personally, I am happy to see words such as nigger changed. The 'updating' of currency and other such things are a different case.
Last edited by Moonraker on 31 Aug 2006, 14:58, edited 1 time in total.
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Mountain of Adventue
Bill, the point you make about today's children is a good one. As an adult if I choose to read the older versions, I have an understanding of the times Enid was writing in. For modern young people it is probably more appropriate that they have the opportunity to read a text which does not offend. I think that important thing is that the kids of today are still reading Enid Blyton long after other children's authors have been forgotten.
My name is Nancy and I have been a Blyton fan since the age of 10 when my brother offered me his copy of The Island of Adventure. That was 45 years ago!
pc etc
i entirely agree with those of you who read blyton in its context.actually i would think that publishers ought not to change the original text at all.rather they should add children-friendly explanatory notes, saying how certain words used in the original text are considered offensive today.
i am sure this can be done.
the charm of enid blyton's world lies in its period authenticity.
editing these books to suit current realities is rather unfair, according to me.
sayantani
i am sure this can be done.
the charm of enid blyton's world lies in its period authenticity.
editing these books to suit current realities is rather unfair, according to me.
sayantani
always in Blytonia...