Bram Stoker - Dracula

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KEVP
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by KEVP »

I can't believe in something just because it says so somewhere on the internet. Anybody these days can get a webpage and just put any sort of "information" on it without anybody verifying the accuracy of the information.

Dracula's Guest is something of a mystery. "It was cut by the publisher because the book was too long" is one solution, but I don't think it is a very good solution.

I think it belongs to a much earlier draft of Dracula, before Stoker had completely worked out where he was going with the book.

In Dracula's guest we have repeats of things that happen in the book as published. Compare it to chapter 1 of Dracula as published. In both we have an innkeeper worried about the English narrator's safety going off in a coach. There is a whole "what day is it" exchange, in Dracula's Guest it is Walpurgisnacht, in Dracula it is the eve of St. George's day. Dracula's Guest says that on Walpurgisnacht "all evil things of air and earth and water hold revel", while chapter 1 of Dracula says that on St. George's day "all the evil things of the world will have full sway". Both have the coachman looking at his watch. In both the horses of the coach panic when they encounter a stranger. People cross themselves in both. In both the coachman implores the English traveler not to continue his journey. In both the English traveler has a conversation with man who is hard to understand because he keeps mixing up two languages. In both the coachman tells the traveler not to walk because of the danger of wolves. In both, snow falls. Both contain the sentence "The Dead Travel Fast". In both the innkeeper has received a letter from Dracula.

Also note that the traveler in Dracula's Guest says he does not speak the coachman's language--German, while Jonathan Harker in chapter one of Dracula says "I found my smattering of German very useful here, indeed, I don't know how I should be able to get on without it." In Dracula's Guest the narrator cannot communicate with German speakers, but in Chapter 1 of Dracula Harker can speak with German speakers, and only has problems when talking to people who do not speak German.

I don't have the time right now to compare "Dracula's Guest" with the rest of Dracula in any detail, but I notice that in Dracula's Guest the narrator is saved from being the victim of a female vampire, similar to how Harker is saved from three female vampires. And the snowstorm in Dracula's Guest makes me think of the snowstorm towards the end of Dracula, faced by Van Helsing and Mina.

In Dracula as published, Harker doesn't encounter anything supernatural before he gets to Bistritz. If he had encountered the supernatural in Munich, this would have put him on his guard, and he wouldn't have been so naïve when he encountered Dracula. Also, "Dracula's Guest" begs the question of how Dracula gets to Munich, and so on. Much of the plot of Dracula is about him trying to get to London, if he can easily get to Munich, as in Dracula's Guest, would London be so difficult?

I did read somewhere (don't have time right now to track it down) that earlier drafts of Dracula involved Munich more, and used Styria instead of Transylvania as the vampire's home. I really think then that "Dracula's Guest" was part of an earlier draft, that Stoker later took out for some of the reasons I put in the preceding paragraph, but then shifted some of the individual details into chapter 1 as we have it, or other places of the novel.
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Soenke Rahn
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by Soenke Rahn »

KEVP wrote:I can't believe in something just because it says so somewhere on the internet. Anybody these days can get a webpage and just put any sort of "information" on it without anybody verifying the accuracy of the information. ...
It's in all published versions of Darculas Guest to read, I have seen, that's also the reason that it is also in this pdf. It's known. You will find it also in other books to this However. If you don't like this first chapter, you are not alone. The publisher liked it also not. ;-)
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Soenke Rahn
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by Soenke Rahn »

KEVP wrote:...

In Dracula's guest we have repeats of things that happen in the book as published. Compare it to chapter 1 of Dracula as published. In both we have an innkeeper worried about the English narrator's safety going off in a coach. There is a whole "what day is it" exchange, in Dracula's Guest it is Walpurgisnacht, in Dracula it is the eve of St. George's day. Dracula's Guest says that on Walpurgisnacht "all evil things of air and earth and water hold revel", while chapter 1 of Dracula says that on St. George's day "all the evil things of the world will have full sway". Both have the coachman looking at his watch. In both the horses of the coach panic when they encounter a stranger. People cross themselves in both. In both the coachman implores the English traveler not to continue his journey. In both the English traveler has a conversation with man who is hard to understand because he keeps mixing up two languages. In both the coachman tells the traveler not to walk because of the danger of wolves. In both, snow falls. Both contain the sentence "The Dead Travel Fast". In both the innkeeper has received a letter from Dracula.

Also note that the traveler in Dracula's Guest says he does not speak the coachman's language--German, while Jonathan Harker in chapter one of Dracula says "I found my smattering of German very useful here, indeed, I don't know how I should be able to get on without it." In Dracula's Guest the narrator cannot communicate with German speakers, but in Chapter 1 of Dracula Harker can speak with German speakers, and only has problems when talking to people who do not speak German.
Nice points, but Stoker used no German word in the novell. But on the other hand the German in Munich is different to the high German an in the rest of the novell it plays not in Germany .... However, little mistakes often so find in such novels. But beside that. If I have it right in my mind, also not the time look for sources, Stokers first idea was to make a novell like Camilla. So I suppose also that this is the rest of this first attempt, but he changed it to the first chapter. ;-) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carmilla At the end of it, if his mysterious adventure he got the letter of Dracula and if I have it right in my mind it is hint that Dracula had rescued him .... ;-) So I suppose that Stoker had build it new, so that it was the first chapter. However the publisher shall erased it. Maybe he knows that. But it's clear, because the links, that for Stoker it was the first chapter. ;-) However, I like the story, but it is a thing of taste. ;-)
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by KEVP »

It's a good story on its own. It doesn't actually say that the protagonist is Jonathan Harker.

I'm just saying it really doesn't work as a new first chapter of the novel Dracula. I think, yes, this was the original first chapter of Dracula in Stoker's original draft. Before he had written any of the rest of the novel and wasn't yet sure where it was going. Then later the novel went off in completely a different direction, and he realized the first chapter he had written no longer fit, so he cut it out, moving some of the details into different parts of Dracula. I think that was the correct decision, for reasons I gave in my earlier post.

Dracula's Guest was published after Stoker died. So we do not have any account directly from Stoker about what it is. It was first published by Stoker's wife, who may not have known what it was.
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by pete9012S »

Soenke Rahn wrote: It's in all published versions of Darculas Guest to read, I have seen, that's also the reason that it is also in this pdf. It's known. You will find it also in other books to this..
Thanks for all your research and clarification Soenke.This book,along with Mary Shelley's Frankenstein is one I keep promising to read.

Who would be the victor in a battle,Dracula or Frankenstein's Monster?
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Soenke Rahn
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by Soenke Rahn »

Ohhh, there exists an old German audio drama series of 70s. with a reporter and his girlfriend, like the X-File couple, and there was an episode named Dracula meets Frankenstein:

Image

I have forgotten who won ..... ;-) I must listen again .... I will report .... ;-)
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by Courtenay »

The horror genre equivalent of Batman v Superman? :lol:
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It was a nuisance. An adventure was one thing - but an adventure without anything to eat was quite another thing. That wouldn't do at all. (The Valley of Adventure)
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by pete9012S »

Image

Well...whilst we're on that theme.....
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

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Image
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KEVP
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by KEVP »

In the "Universal" series of monster movies, Dracula and the Frankenstein monster first meet in the movie "House of Frankenstein" (1944), together with the Wolfman. All three monsters meet again in "House of Dracula" (1945), and then finally in "Abbott and Costello Meet Frankenstein" (1948), the last appearance of the Universal versions of Dracula, the Wolfman, and the Frankenstein Monster.

I am resisting the urge to try to intelligently determine who would win in a fight between Dracula and the Frankenstein Monster. I feel like when fan discussions get into "if x fought y, who would win?" there isn't much point any more.
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by pete9012S »

Great pic Dave! :D
Is it from a film?
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by Domino »

No, it's not from a film, Pete. It's the illustration on an old record album by American rock group, 'Y and T' (originally they were called 'Yesterday and Today', but after two albums preferred to use the initials). I've never heard it, but, by coincidence, was looking at some illustrations by the artist, Neon Park (aka Martin Muller), the other day, and it just seemed it was appropriate to adapt it for this thread.

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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by Machupicchu14 »

I read Dracula about two years ago and found it a great book, not a bit boring and the action is very well narrated. I love the ending but I find it very sad, although I know Dracula was at peace in the end, which was good. I don't know how Bram Stoker did it, but from the very first pages, Count Dracula became my favourite character and I found him the most interesting person in the novel. Therefore it was sad when they killed him.
It's strange, how Dracula is referred to as a horror book and it really surprised me when it didn't made me feel scare at all, when I hadn't been totally afraid of him as a small child.

It's a book I would greatly like to read again though I don't feel like watching any Dracula movie.

(OK, don't think I am crazy after reading this) :|
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by KEVP »

I think that illustrates how much times have changed since Dracula was written. I am pretty sure that the original Victorian readers of Dracula immediately identified Dracula as a villain, and were afraid of him. But since values have completely shifted since Victorian times, modern readers often find Dracula admirable. There are lots of books about Dracula written in modern times where Dracula is the hero.
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Re: Bram Stoker - Dracula

Post by Machupicchu14 »

That's probably true, KEVP!!
I wonder what exactly changed for that to happen. The image of Dracula as a villain most likely came from what the first readers thought of him , assuming even small children who haven't read the book have a fixed idea of how he is like.
There is a kind of "Dracula's Castle" in Dublin in the place where Bram Stoker lived. I would really love to go there as they say it's a scary and interesting place!! :D
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