English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by Fiona1986 »

I've only ever heard back, not bat in that phrase. And I've heard dishwater far more often than ditchwater.
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by Daisy »

Eddie Muir wrote:The presenter probably said with a capital 'ch' to indicate how good the tune was in his opinion. Capital letters tend to be used as emphasis.
I used the capital letters to indicate the name of the two letters... did he say 'ch' or 'C (cee) H (aitch)' ?
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by Rob Houghton »

I think the 'dish-water' and 'off his own back' are just examples of people miss-hearing, and also not understanding the meaning, as it might be outside their personal experience, so they transfer the saying into something they understand better.

I've heard people say 'dull as dish-water' but I know its not right, and I would always say 'as dull as ditch-water'. The same goes for 'off his own back' - doesn't actually make sense to me, while 'off his own bat' is the phrase I always use.

Many sayings like this have been corrupted over the years - especially around Birmingham, I think. One that has become part of every-day usage is 'donkey's years' which actually should be 'donkey's ears', I believe, because donkey's ears are long.
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by Katharine »

Daisy, he said 'ch', so I suppose that must mean it was meant tongue in cheek, although as 'ch' is a di-graph, I suppose some people might think it could be classified as a letter.
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by IceMaiden »

Anita Bensoussane wrote:I've only ever heard "dull as ditchwater" but I can see how "dull as dishwater" might creep in.

I've heard a couple of people say someone did something "off his own back" instead of "off his own bat" so that's another phrase that may well evolve.
I've only heard 'ditchwater' as well.

Two that I see increasingly online are 'on tenderhooks' and 'a damp squid'.
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by Daisy »

IceMaiden wrote: Two that I see increasingly online are 'on tenderhooks' and 'a damp squid'.
I chuckle at the "damp squid" ...considering their environment I should think they are all pretty damp!
"Tenderhooks" for "tenterhooks" is an understandable mistake I guess. People who don't read a lot must hear (or mis-hear) many words they never see written down.
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by KEVP »

I have seen the word "choon" used online to mean "tune".

I am pretty sure it is a tongue-in-cheek slang expression, people intentionally misspelling the word for fun.
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by Eddie Muir »

The OED gives the following definition of choon:

Origin 1990s: informal respelling of tune.
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by Anita Bensoussane »

IceMaiden wrote:Two that I see increasingly online are 'on tenderhooks' and 'a damp squid'.
I used to think it was "on tenderhooks" when I was a child - and then I saw how it was written!
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by Fiona1986 »

I've had to look up 'off his own bat' as like I said, I don't think I've ever heard anyone actually say that.

http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/off-his-own-bat.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
One question that often gets asked on this website about the figurative expression 'off his own bat' is "should that be 'off his own back'"? Well no, it shouldn't. 'Off your own back' originated as a mishearing of the former expression. It has gained sufficient currency to be considered as a viable everyday alternative of the correct version, but purists dismiss it as a straightforward error...

The bat in question is a cricket bat and the first activity that was said to be done 'off someone's own bat' was to score runs.

The first citation of 'off his own bat' in print comes from the pen of the celebrated cricket historian and statistician Henry Thomas Waghorn, in Cricket Scores, 1742:

"The bets on the Slendon man's head that he got 40 notches off his own bat were lost."
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by Courtenay »

I've always heard it as "off one's own bat" and figured it originally referred to cricket. Must admit I always assumed the "dull as..." was "dishwater" — well, the water you wash the dishes in is pretty dull by the time you've finished! — but "ditchwater" does make more sense, so I will make sure to say it correctly in future. 8)
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by KEVP »

When I was a child I heard people talking about "razing a building to the ground", I always thought they were saying "raising". Like it was some idiom, they were raising it to the ground, so not raising it at all.
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by sixret »

Please help.

Taken from GAD group:

Now I have finished the translation of Leo Bruce's "Case for Sergeant Beef." Checking my translation, I have some questions, and I hope someone in this group might help me.

1) In chapter 1, Townsend call on Sgt. Beef, and Beef tells him "Hullo. I was wondering when you'd turn up. Come along in. And a happy New Year!" Actually, it was New Year's Eve that they visited Barnford to investigate their case. Do you usually say "A happy New Year!" before New Year's day?

2) In chapter 21, Mrs. Pluck replies Beef's question, "Well, if you want to know he's been funny, Very funny." To this, Townsend wrote, "This common, but curious, misuse of the language did not perturb Beef," I cannot understand what is the misuse of the language.

3) In chapter 24, I came across the following expression: "Mrs. Pluck was in the bottle and jug and wanted to see Beef most particular." What does "in the bottle and jug" mean?
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by sixret »

London.

The book was first published in 1947.

To put the questions into perspective.
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Re: English Grammar, Spelling and Vocabulary

Post by Katharine »

1) I've never heard anyone wish a happy new year before the day, but then I'd never heard of the word 'chunes' until this week either. :D

2) I'd need to know more about the context of the word funny. Funny can mean amusing, as in telling jokes or playing tricks. It can also mean feeling unwell, as in someone had a funny turn, or a funny tummy. Or it could mean that someone feels that someone has been behaving unusually, perhaps being unfriendly for no obvious reason.

3) If capital letters are used for bottle and jug, it would suggest to me it is the name of a pub. I think I've heard of someone 'being in jug' when they are in jail.
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