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Rob Houghton
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Rob Houghton »

Sorry, yes: I just meant that it would be good to have the 'latest posts' section (from the forums) above the message board. It would look tidier then, maybe. Also, the message boards have to be read backwards, as you say (last post first) which I don't really like. But it's just my opinion. Sorry if it upsets anyone!!

By the way: I think it's much much better not to have a committee controlling the EB society. I have been a member of a committee for many years in my Musical society and they are far too pedantic!! I'll be glad when I come off it in April! :roll:

The EB society is a lot more democratic. Anyone can have a say on how things are done, and I think that's much better than five or six people on a committee. :D
'Oh voice of Spring of Youth
hearts mad delight,
Sing on, sing on, and when the sun is gone
I'll warm me with your echoes
through the night.'

(E. Blyton, Sunday Times, 1951)



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Anita Bensoussane
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Anita Bensoussane »

I agree that one person having ultimate authority (though always listening to input from other members) is more efficient and more convenient. Although whenever Tony decides that the time has come for him to take more of a back seat (even he can't go on working like a Trojan forever and a day!), I wonder if we'll ever find just one person who is able to do all that he does? At some point in the future, we may possibly find ourselves in a position where we'll be forced to allocate different tasks to different people. Producing the Journal involves an incredible amount of work and then there are things like working on the website, organising the Enid Blyton Day, answering enquiries, dealing with the media, keeping records and accounts, etc.

Sorry to have gone a bit off-topic! From various comments it seems that most people are okay with the message board and understand the reasons for having one, but don't want it to dominate the Home Page.

Anita
"Heyho for a starry night and a heathery bed!" - Jack, The Secret Island.

"There is no bond like the bond of having read and liked the same books."
- E. Nesbit, The Wonderful Garden.


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Tony Summerfield
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Tony Summerfield »

Anita Bensoussane wrote:From various comments it seems that most people are okay with the message board and understand the reasons for having one, but don't want it to dominate the Home Page.

Anita
Remember though, that all the various comments are coming from biased forumites! :lol: There may well be a large silent majority out there who don't want the latest forum posts to dominate the Home Page!! We might end up with a much smaller tidier Home Page if there were simply quick pictorial links to both. In theory LS's earlier idea of a Questionnaire sounds good - in practice however, few people can be bothered to fill them in, which is why you often see free gifts offered for those that do.
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Moonraker
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Moonraker »

Tony Summerfield wrote: Remember though, that all the various comments are coming from biased forumites! .......We might end up with a much smaller tidier Home Page if there were simply quick pictorial links to both.
This is exactly what i had in mind. There is no need for dedicated Forumites to access the Home Page at all - simply View New Posts, as I do. The Home Page can then be kept much tidier for non-Society/Forum Members to look at. I wrote a long post much along the lines of Tony's yesterday, but when I read it it didn't make much sense, so I discarded it! :D
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Petermax
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Petermax »

Initially I had quite a few reservations about the new message board, largely due to the large number of various "Trolls" who post randomly on message boards and guest books. However, I now know that all posts are vetted prior to publication, I had visions of unBlyton-like language greeting first time visitors to the E.B.S homepage!

The only problem remaining is that perhaps too many messages are displayed which means that we have to scroll down to view recent Forum posts. This is a minor grumble however, and a matter that can no doubt be fine tuned . Overall, anything that can draw in more casual visitors to the website is a very good thing.

Ironically, I stumbled across the EBS website in January last year purely by chance when I suddenly had a pang of nostalgia and decided to find out about the 1970s Famous Five TV series. Via Google I located an EBS Forum thread on the subject and many memories were unlocked, not just the TV series but also the many EB books that I had last read prior to 1979. After that year I followed other pursuits, most of my Enid Blyton library was consigned to the attic or given away.
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Keith Robinson
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Keith Robinson »

Wow! Just checked in and found a lot of very helpful opinions and ideas about the message board. This is what we need to fine tune things!

The biggest "groan" is the number of messages being displayed on the board, so I've changed this (for the moment) to 7 rather than 20. You may think I was out of my mind displaying 20, and you might be right! -- but sometimes messages can be short one-liners and if you have seven of those in a row then it would look pretty pitiful. But I agree 20 of the current chunky posts is way too many. It's very easy to change though, so we'll go with 7 for now and see how it goes.

I have 15 messages displayed on my own site; I thought it was 20, but I remembered wrong. Plus, my own content area is wider that the EBS one, and this makes a big difference in the display. (In fact, widening the content area is something I'd like to do in the future, if we can.)

The second biggest "groan" was that the message board should be placed after the forum links. Actually I had a hard time deciding about that when I first put the MB up, so this doesn't surprise me. So I've swapped them around. In fact, those using the forum links will find them higher up than they were before, because the old News section is now gone.

There was a mention about adding a link to see the older messages. Actually the old messages are stored on the Post-a-Message page -- it's just that in these early days of just a few messages, there's no point having a link saying "see more messages" when in fact there aren't any extra! But now that we have a limit of 7 on the home page, and a total of 17 messages so far (therefore 10 in the "archives"), you'll see that there's a link at the foot of the home page saying "see more messages and post one of your own." (I'll have to add a restriction to those in the archives sometime too. Currently my own site shows 15 on the home page, 50 on the Post-a-Message page, and an extra option to display ALL messages if you really want to -- all 1198 of them!)

Displaying the messages in reverse date order is a must, I'm afraid. It's easy to change the order, but it doesn't make much sense for people to have to scroll to the bottom to see if there are any new ones, while meanwhile the top-most, older messages scroll off the top! There's a big difference between a paginated system (like these forums) and a simple one-page "scrolling" system (where the latest show at the top of the page and the older ones drop off the bottom).

Oh, just a quick clarification on the subject of hits. The "hits" statistic for a website is pretty worthless in terms of counting visitors. As Tony knows, it's the "visits" that matter. Yes, March has seen 1,000 visits per day, on target for 30,000 visits this month. As for "hits," we've had 26,272 per day in March, or 735,641 this month so far. Oh, if only that were the number of unique visitors! But no, hits are basically a count of elements on each page that loads. If a page has five images on it, then it might only be one visit but six hits (including the page file itself). The nice masthead image at the top of this site is hit every single time you browse from page to page. Look at the smilies to the right when you post a message here -- there are 22 of them! They're only small, but that's 22 hits, plus the page, plus the masthead image at the top, plus other small images dotted about the page... So you can see that hits add up pretty quickly! I've had many excited clients saying "I've had half a million hits this month!" ...it's a shame to tell them, "Yes, but only about 23 visitors."

What else? Nigel mentioned that my site (EB.net) can go a couple of days without messages being approved, and he's right, so it's very nice that the one on this site is being looked after so promptly by Anita and Tony. I'm trying to keep on top of my own message board, as I know it must be frustrating to post something and then wait a couple of days for me to check it! I have a plan formulating to deal with this...

Okay, that's all for now. Keep the suggestions rolling in! It's easy to tweak things, so don't be afraid to put in your votes. After I read three or four posts in this thread saying one thing, that was enough to do something about it. See, we're not living in a dictatorship here! :D
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Anita Bensoussane
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Anita Bensoussane »

Great stuff, Keith. I didn't have a clue about the difference between "hits" and "visits" before.
[Keith:] But now that we have a limit of 7 on the home page, and a total of 17 messages so far (therefore 10 in the "archives"), you'll see that there's a link at the foot of the home page saying "see more messages and post one of your own."
Except that the link actually says, "See more messages and post of your own"! :P

Anita
"Heyho for a starry night and a heathery bed!" - Jack, The Secret Island.

"There is no bond like the bond of having read and liked the same books."
- E. Nesbit, The Wonderful Garden.


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Rob Houghton
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Favourite book/series: Rubadub Mystery, Famous Five and The Find-Outers
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Location: Kings Norton, Birmingham

Re: New Message Board

Post by Rob Houghton »

Thanks Keith. The home page looks a lot neater to me already - although I'm probably a bit biased! That's just what I meant about the EB Society being all the better for not having a committee! :D
'Oh voice of Spring of Youth
hearts mad delight,
Sing on, sing on, and when the sun is gone
I'll warm me with your echoes
through the night.'

(E. Blyton, Sunday Times, 1951)



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Keith Robinson
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Keith Robinson »

You're welcome, Robert! And Anita, you win a bumper bag of charcoal for spotting my deliberate error! :D
Tony Summerfield
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Tony Summerfield »

Moonraker wrote:Enter enid blyton into Google and we come up in third place. Keith's enidblyton.net is at the top and Wikipedia is in second! For goodness sake, we are the official society website and we come behind Wikipedia! I can understand it when you ask, "Am I wasting my time?" Tony! You most certainly are not, I hasten to reply, but it does make you think.
Just stressing the importance of Google. I put famous five into search, just to see where we came. Keith was on top, but the first mention we got was on page 8 in 79th position - and that was the recent post on the new Message Board about ebay. Our next mention didn't come up until page 12 in position 120th - and this was the first mention that the Book Listings got!! I still wonder if I am wasting my time! :roll:
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Keith Robinson »

Golly! Tony, the fact that the message board post is the first "famous five" listing for this site proves (already!) how useful the message board might turn out to be! Regularly changing content on the home page is always a good idea.

Maybe getting off the beaten track here a little, but one reason my site comes up higher is because I use the keywords in the title and filename as well as in the content. For instance, here's my listing:
Enid Blyton - The Famous Five
The Famous Five are a group of children who have the sort of adventures most kids dream about, in a world where ginger beer flows and ham rolls are a staple ...
http://www.enidblyton.net/famous-five/ - 16k - Cached - Similar pages - Note this
Optimizing the EBS site in this way is one of the things on my To Do list when we do some updates. It's not too late; for years I was way down on the listing for search terms like "website design" (because it's too generic and I'm competing with the whole world) but then I targeted local areas and added pages like chickamauga-web-design.html and chattanooga-web-design.html, and now if you type in "chickamauga web design" I'm right at the top of Google. A smaller catchment area, but top positions. Like being a big fish in a small pond instead of a small fish in a big pond.

With the EBS site we need to make sure that the book listing pages contain keywords in the filenames, as well as in the title tags and other elements. I have plans for all that stuff which will undoubtedly help in the future.
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Lucky Star
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Lucky Star »

Tony Summerfield wrote:I still wonder if I am wasting my time! :roll:
No you are not wasting youe time Tony. In the book listing you have created, and are still creating, the worlds best and most comprehensive catalogue of the work of Enid Blyton. It is endlessly fascinating and beautifully illustrated. It combines factual knowledge, informative opinion and original artwork in a way that should satisfy the needs of any person seeking Blyton knowledge. The problem at this point appears to be letting people know that it exists! Hopefully keith's technical suggestions above may help to resolve that issue.
"What a lot of trouble one avoids if one refuses to have anything to do with the common herd. To have no job, to devote ones life to literature, is the most wonderful thing in the world. - Cicero

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Julie2owlsdene
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Julie2owlsdene »

It's a lovely idea to have the message board, so non registered viewers can ask a question etc. It also looks neater now that its been placed after the forum topics. I always like to visit the home page first, read up on some of the book listings etc., then go into the forums, and view the active topics, as the variety is longer, and you don't miss anything from over the last few days.

The site is lovely and an easy one to get around.

8)
Julian gave an exclamation and nudged George.
"See that? It's the black Bentley again. KMF 102!"

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Keith Robinson
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Keith Robinson »

Tony Summerfield wrote:We might end up with a much smaller tidier Home Page if there were simply quick pictorial links to both.
Moonraker wrote:This is exactly what i had in mind. There is no need for dedicated Forumites to access the Home Page at all - simply View New Posts, as I do.
You're both right of course, but from a search engine standpoint you're both wrong. :D

We already know search engines crawl the site regularly, perhaps every 1-2 weeks. Let's say it takes two weeks to get all around the internet and back to this site again, and the site is crawled every other Friday. If you're very lucky, you can make a change on a Thursday and the next day the bots return for their regular crawl about -- so it would appear that bots crawl every day! On the other hand you may not make a change until moments after the bots have stopped by, in which case a search engine update might seem like an age.

But in either case, changes to the site are picked up, and changes to the home page are of particular importance to search engines. So in my view it's vital to have a lot of regularly changing text on the home page, hence the importance of the ten forum links and the 7-10 latest messages.

We can have big fat buttons linking to other pages for sure, placed high on the home page and dressed up to look nice. But there's no reason the messages can't stay on the page too, further down, where they're perhaps out of the way.
Tony Summerfield
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Re: New Message Board

Post by Tony Summerfield »

Keith Robinson wrote:We already know search engines crawl the site regularly, perhaps every 1-2 weeks. Let's say it takes two weeks to get all around the internet and back to this site again, and the site is crawled every other Friday. If you're very lucky, you can make a change on a Thursday and the next day the bots return for their regular crawl about -- so it would appear that bots crawl every day! On the other hand you may not make a change until moments after the bots have stopped by, in which case a search engine update might seem like an age.
I hesitate to question your undoubted wisdom in these matters, Keith, but I have noticed that every time that I now check the forums (which is several times a day, every day) either Yahoo or Google, often both, are also logged on. It doesn't seem to fit your every one or two weeks theory?
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